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From: Randy Yates <>
Subject: Sourceware.Org Mailing Lists 20200830192428
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2020 20:31:32 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <> (raw)

This email refers to the mailing lists associated with                  .

On the page "Suggestions" it is stated:

        So, if, for some reason, there is an impediment to your using this site,
        whether psychological, moral, technical, or political, please let us know.

I assume I am addressing Christopher Faylor. I take issue with your statement which
was sent out to the crossgcc mailing list this evening:

Unsubscribe  problems  apparently  solved
Christopher  Faylor  <>
8/30/20,  4:19  PM

Hi  all,
The  two  people  for  whom  the  unsubscribe  instructions  "did  not  work"
apparently  managed  to  follow  the  instructions  and  unsubscribe.

Sorry  for  the  noise.   You'd  think  that  a  technical  mailing  list  wouldn't
have  these  types  of  problems.

Btw,  the  name  of  this  mailing  list  is  "crossgcc".   I  don't  know  why
something  is  adding  "crosstool-ng"  to  the  subject  but  it's  not  being
done  by

(20  year  volunteer  admin)

For  unsubscribe  information  see

The tenor of your message (e.g., `noise" and "these types of problems") implies we
are idiots. I am a degreed electrical engineer and mathematician and have engineered
hardware, systems, and software for some 40 years now (see                    ).
I submit that these problems are due to several bad server implementation decisions
and poor site design in the web interface layout and text:

    1.  It is at least an unwritten rule in mailing list organization that all "shotgunned"
        messages include a prefix in the subject indicating the mailing list, e.g., [yocto-
        developer], [bacnet], [crossgcc], etc.  However, the crossgcc mailing list does
        not.  This should be corrected.


    2.  Why is the crossgcc list being used for crosstools-ng discussions?  Why not
        have a separate list?  crossgcc is only one of a number of utilities (binutils
        being another) which are commonly used for cross-platform development.

    3.  The mailing lists FAQ is poorly laid out.  It does not flow well.

          (a) The  order  of  the  topics  are  not  ordered  by  the  most  likely  topics  list
              subscribers want to address.

         (b)  There is a block of information at the beginning (prior to the table of
              contents) that diverts the user's attention.  It would be better placed in
              table of contents.

          (c) There is unwanted humor which must be ignored when attempting to
              find useful information.

         (d)  The unsubscription link at the top is idempotent.

          (e) There are links which don't lead anywhere.

    4.  At the bottom of each shotgunned message is a footer/.sig:

        For  unsubscribe  information  see

        That link simply leads you to the FAQ which is very general.  It is for three
        different mail list servers, and a multitude of lists on each.

        This requires the user to drill down to the proper topic (unsubscribing), mail
        list server (, and mailing list (crossgcc) before they can actu-
        ally get to the meat of the unsubscription mechanism.

        Instead, the mail server could greatly simplify unsubscribing by generating a
        custom link for the server and list directly into the footer: *
 *                          .

----Randy Yates

Randy Yates, DSP/Embedded Firmware Developer
Digital Signal Labs

             reply	other threads:[~2020-08-31  0:31 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 5+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-08-31  0:31 Randy Yates [this message]
2020-08-31  0:47 ` Bryan Hundven
2020-08-31  4:06 ` Christopher Faylor
2020-08-31  4:19   ` Chris Punches
2020-08-31  4:35     ` Chris Punches

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