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From: Bryan Hundven <>
To: Randy Yates <>
Cc:, crossgcc maillist <>
Subject: Re: Sourceware.Org Mailing Lists 20200830192428
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2020 17:47:19 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <>


On Sun, Aug 30, 2020 at 5:33 PM Randy Yates <>

> This email refers to the mailing lists associated with
>                  .
> On the page "Suggestions" it is stated:
>         So, if, for some reason, there is an impediment to your using this
> site,
>         whether psychological, moral, technical, or political, please let
> us know.
> I assume I am addressing Christopher Faylor. I take issue with your
> statement which
> was sent out to the crossgcc mailing list this evening:
> Subject:
> Unsubscribe  problems  apparently  solved
> From:
> Christopher  Faylor  <>
> Date:
> 8/30/20,  4:19  PM
> To:
> Hi  all,
> The  two  people  for  whom  the  unsubscribe  instructions  "did  not
> work"
> apparently  managed  to  follow  the  instructions  and  unsubscribe.
> Sorry  for  the  noise.   You'd  think  that  a  technical  mailing  list
> wouldn't
> have  these  types  of  problems.
> Btw,  the  name  of  this  mailing  list  is  "crossgcc".   I  don't
> know  why
> something  is  adding  "crosstool-ng"  to  the  subject  but  it's  not
> being
> done  by
> cgf
> (20  year  volunteer  admin)
> --
> For  unsubscribe  information  see
> The tenor of your message (e.g., `noise" and "these types of problems")
> implies we
> are idiots. I am a degreed electrical engineer and mathematician and have
> engineered
> hardware, systems, and software for some 40 years now (see
>                    ).
> I submit that these problems are due to several bad server implementation
> decisions
> and poor site design in the web interface layout and text:
I meant nothing in offense to sourceware, and I was suggesting that we
should remove our changes from the mailing list and keep crosstool-ng on, as that seems to be the reason that people want to unsubscribe
from the list.

>     1.  It is at least an unwritten rule in mailing list organization that
> all "shotgunned"
>         messages include a prefix in the subject indicating the mailing
> list, e.g., [yocto-
>         developer], [bacnet], [crossgcc], etc.  However, the crossgcc
> mailing list does
>         not.  This should be corrected.
>                                                   1
We have already corrected crosstool-ng to no longer mail crossgcc, again, I
apologize for my poor use of words. I mean no harm.

>     2.  Why is the crossgcc list being used for crosstools-ng
> discussions?  Why not
>         have a separate list?  crossgcc is only one of a number of
> utilities (binutils
>         being another) which are commonly used for cross-platform
> development.
Again, crosstool-ng development used to happen on this mailing list (for as
far back as I can remember), and we are correcting that now.

>     3.  The mailing lists FAQ is poorly laid out.  It does
> not flow well.
>           (a) The  order  of  the  topics  are  not  ordered  by  the
> most  likely  topics  list
>               subscribers want to address.
>          (b)  There is a block of information at the beginning (prior to
> the table of
>               contents) that diverts the user's attention.  It would be
> better placed in
>               table of contents.
>           (c) There is unwanted humor which must be ignored when
> attempting to
>               find useful information.
>          (d)  The unsubscription link at the top is idempotent.
>           (e) There are links which don't lead anywhere.
I don't know how to respond to this... I have no administrative ability on
this mailing list. How can I be of service to help this? I want to be

>     4.  At the bottom of each shotgunned message is a footer/.sig:
>         --
>         For  unsubscribe  information  see
>         That link simply leads you to the FAQ which is very general.  It
> is for three
>         different mail list servers, and a multitude of lists on each.
>         This requires the user to drill down to the proper topic
> (unsubscribing), mail
>         list server (, and mailing list (crossgcc) before
> they can actu-
>         ally get to the meat of the unsubscription mechanism.
>         Instead, the mail server could greatly simplify unsubscribing by
> generating a
>         custom link for the server and list directly into the footer:
> *
>  *                          .
Randy, again, I apologize. I was trying to find someone that can help, as I
have no control over the mailing list, the faq or anything on sourceware. I
do have control over how crosstool-ng messages out, and again, we have
corrected that and will no longer message to crossgcc.

I am 100% honest in my sincerity, and was trying to help.

I hope you can forgive me.

> ----Randy Yates
>                                                   2
> Randy Yates, DSP/Embedded Firmware Developer
> Digital Signal Labs
> --
> For unsubscribe information see

-Bryan Hundven
Admin/Co-Maintainer of Crosstool-NG

  reply	other threads:[~2020-08-31  0:47 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 5+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-08-31  0:31 Randy Yates
2020-08-31  0:47 ` Bryan Hundven [this message]
2020-08-31  4:06 ` Christopher Faylor
2020-08-31  4:19   ` Chris Punches
2020-08-31  4:35     ` Chris Punches

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