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* Re: Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions
       [not found]   ` <CAMgm8F0f1uNyoeE-_SFSQCbOUcK-y9kj3saq0dBC3Rw4jxzL4w@mail.gmail.com>
@ 2012-12-05  9:05     ` Chaz Littlejohn
  2012-12-05  9:39       ` Corinna Vinschen
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Chaz Littlejohn @ 2012-12-05  9:05 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: cygwin-licensing

> On 12/4/2012 4:34 PM, Chaz Littlejohn wrote:
> IANAL but I believe there are 2 issues here:
>
>   1. Whether your use of Cygwin means your program also needs to fall under
>      the GPL
>
>   2. Distribution of the Cygwin DLL and its utilities
>
> If what you describe above about your usage of Cygwin is correct, then I
> believe (1) is not an issue for you.  However, (2) still applies since you
> cannot distribute GPL'd software without providing the source as well.

I'm not sure if the two are separate. Assuming the program
communicates with cygwin utilities only via command line arguments and
they're not sharing complex data structures, i believe it would be
considered "aggregate" rather than an "modified". From the GPL FAQ
(http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#MereAggregation):

"An “aggregate” consists of a number of separate programs, distributed
together on the same CD-ROM or other media. The GPL permits you to
create and distribute an aggregate, even when the licenses of the
other software are non-free or GPL-incompatible. The only condition is
that you cannot release the aggregate under a license that prohibits
users from exercising rights that each program's individual license
would grant them."

Our terms still need to be updated (https://pokeit.co/terms)

It was asked that this conversation be moved to the licensing mailing
list. Previous messages can be found here:

http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2012-12/msg00007.html
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2012-12/msg00020.html
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2012-12/msg00024.html
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2012-12/msg00052.html
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2012-12/msg00053.html

(IANAL, applies to me as well)

Thanks,
Chaz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions
  2012-12-05  9:05     ` Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions Chaz Littlejohn
@ 2012-12-05  9:39       ` Corinna Vinschen
  2012-12-06  6:14         ` Chaz Littlejohn
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Corinna Vinschen @ 2012-12-05  9:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: cygwin-licensing

On Dec  4 18:39, Chaz Littlejohn wrote:
> > On 12/4/2012 4:34 PM, Chaz Littlejohn wrote:
> > IANAL but I believe there are 2 issues here:
> >
> >   1. Whether your use of Cygwin means your program also needs to fall under
> >      the GPL
> >
> >   2. Distribution of the Cygwin DLL and its utilities
> >
> > If what you describe above about your usage of Cygwin is correct, then I
> > believe (1) is not an issue for you.  However, (2) still applies since you
> > cannot distribute GPL'd software without providing the source as well.
> 
> I'm not sure if the two are separate. Assuming the program
> communicates with cygwin utilities only via command line arguments and
> they're not sharing complex data structures, i believe it would be
> considered "aggregate" rather than an "modified". From the GPL FAQ
> (http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#MereAggregation):
> 
> "An “aggregate” consists of a number of separate programs, distributed
> together on the same CD-ROM or other media. The GPL permits you to
> create and distribute an aggregate, even when the licenses of the
> other software are non-free or GPL-incompatible. The only condition is
> that you cannot release the aggregate under a license that prohibits
> users from exercising rights that each program's individual license
> would grant them."

What you're missing is the fact that you're still required to adhere to
the licensing of the individual packages, even if your own prorietary
stuff doesn't link aginst the OSS code.  That means, for the Cygwin DLL,
being under GPLv3+, you have to provide the sources of the package as
well, using the exact version you provide in binary form.

Not many people take their right to fetch the sources as well, but
they *have* a right to it, at least as far as the GPL goes.

The most simple way to accomplish this is to add a sources download
URL where you provide the source packages of all the OSS packages you
use.  It's not *that* much work.


Corinna

-- 
Corinna Vinschen                  Please, send mails regarding Cygwin to
Cygwin Project Co-Leader          cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Red Hat

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions
  2012-12-05  9:39       ` Corinna Vinschen
@ 2012-12-06  6:14         ` Chaz Littlejohn
  2012-12-06  6:21           ` Christopher Faylor
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Chaz Littlejohn @ 2012-12-06  6:14 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: cygwin-licensing

On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 4:26 AM, Corinna Vinschen wrote:
> The most simple way to accomplish this is to add a sources download
> URL where you provide the source packages of all the OSS packages you
> use.  It's not *that* much work.

No problem, we'll add those links to the terms.

Thanks,
Chaz

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions
  2012-12-06  6:14         ` Chaz Littlejohn
@ 2012-12-06  6:21           ` Christopher Faylor
  2012-12-06  8:26             ` Corinna Vinschen
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Christopher Faylor @ 2012-12-06  6:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: cygwin-licensing

On Thu, Dec 06, 2012 at 12:43:50AM -0500, Chaz Littlejohn wrote:
>On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 4:26 AM, Corinna Vinschen wrote:
>> The most simple way to accomplish this is to add a sources download
>> URL where you provide the source packages of all the OSS packages you
>> use.  It's not *that* much work.
>
>No problem, we'll add those links to the terms.

Just to be really clear: These links should not be to the Cygwin web site.
You need to provide the exact sources that go with the binaries that you
distribute.  You can't rely on the Cygwin site to provide those.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions
  2012-12-06  6:21           ` Christopher Faylor
@ 2012-12-06  8:26             ` Corinna Vinschen
  2012-12-06 12:50               ` Chaz
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Corinna Vinschen @ 2012-12-06  8:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: cygwin-licensing

On Dec  6 01:19, Christopher Faylor wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 06, 2012 at 12:43:50AM -0500, Chaz Littlejohn wrote:
> >On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 4:26 AM, Corinna Vinschen wrote:
> >> The most simple way to accomplish this is to add a sources download
> >> URL where you provide the source packages of all the OSS packages you
> >> use.  It's not *that* much work.
> >
> >No problem, we'll add those links to the terms.
> 
> Just to be really clear: These links should not be to the Cygwin web site.
> You need to provide the exact sources that go with the binaries that you
> distribute.  You can't rely on the Cygwin site to provide those.

Exactly.  Apparently my wording was unclear.  What I was trying to say
is that you, Chaz, could create a sources download area on your web
server where you provide the source packages of the OSS binaries you
use.  It's not sufficient to link to the upstream project page.  That's
a common misconception.


Corinna

-- 
Corinna Vinschen                  Please, send mails regarding Cygwin to
Cygwin Project Co-Leader          cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Red Hat

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions
  2012-12-06  8:26             ` Corinna Vinschen
@ 2012-12-06 12:50               ` Chaz
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Chaz @ 2012-12-06 12:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: cygwin-licensing

On Dec 6, 2012, at 3:08 AM, Corinna Vinschen

> On Dec  6 01:19, Christopher Faylor wrote:
>> On Thu, Dec 06, 2012 at 12:43:50AM -0500, Chaz Littlejohn wrote:
>>> On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 4:26 AM, Corinna Vinschen wrote:
>>>> The most simple way to accomplish this is to add a sources download
>>>> URL where you provide the source packages of all the OSS packages you
>>>> use.  It's not *that* much work.
>>> 
>>> No problem, we'll add those links to the terms.
>> 
>> Just to be really clear: These links should not be to the Cygwin web site.
>> You need to provide the exact sources that go with the binaries that you
>> distribute.  You can't rely on the Cygwin site to provide those.
> 
> Exactly.  Apparently my wording was unclear.  What I was trying to say
> is that you, Chaz, could create a sources download area on your web
> server where you provide the source packages of the OSS binaries you
> use.  It's not sufficient to link to the upstream project page.  That's
> a common misconception.

Ok, yes. That makes sense.Thanks for the clarification. 

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2012-12-06 12:50 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 6+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
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2012-12-05  9:05     ` Bug in Cygwin Windows 8 group permissions Chaz Littlejohn
2012-12-05  9:39       ` Corinna Vinschen
2012-12-06  6:14         ` Chaz Littlejohn
2012-12-06  6:21           ` Christopher Faylor
2012-12-06  8:26             ` Corinna Vinschen
2012-12-06 12:50               ` Chaz

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