RE: -mwindows copyright?

RE: -mwindows copyright?

[McCunney, Dennis]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: PositivePi@aol.com [ mailto:PositivePi@aol.com ]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 1999 4:06 PM
> To: cygwin@sourceware.cygnus.com
> Subject: -mwindows copyright?
> 
>   I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile 
> my program.  I'm also binding to several other windows libs 
> such as -lwsock32. I want to distribute my programs--as well 
> as source--entirely public domain.  The  copyright on all of 
> the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok 
> there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, 
> some of them have copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
> --snip--
> ;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
> ;
> ;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
> ;
> ;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
> ;   Date: 1996
> ;   
> ;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
> ;
> ;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
> ;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
> ;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
> ;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
> --snip--
> Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either 
> have to distribute my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for 
> windows API? (which I imagine would be a minor pain)

Er, Public Domain explicitly means _no_ copyright.

Why is distributing under the GNU liscense a problem?  The trouble
with releasing software into the public domain is that anyone is
free to pick it up, make their own changes, copyright it, and _sell_
it as their own.  The GNU copyleft is designed to prevent that sort
of thing.

______
Dennis

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RE: -mwindows copyright?

[McCunney, Dennis]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: PositivePi@aol.com [ mailto:PositivePi@aol.com ]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 1999 4:06 PM
> To: cygwin@sourceware.cygnus.com
> Subject: -mwindows copyright?
> 
>   I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile 
> my program.  I'm also binding to several other windows libs 
> such as -lwsock32. I want to distribute my programs--as well 
> as source--entirely public domain.  The  copyright on all of 
> the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok 
> there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, 
> some of them have copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
> --snip--
> ;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
> ;
> ;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
> ;
> ;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
> ;   Date: 1996
> ;   
> ;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
> ;
> ;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
> ;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
> ;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
> ;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
> --snip--
> Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either 
> have to distribute my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for 
> windows API? (which I imagine would be a minor pain)

Er, Public Domain explicitly means _no_ copyright.

Why is distributing under the GNU liscense a problem?  The trouble
with releasing software into the public domain is that anyone is
free to pick it up, make their own changes, copyright it, and _sell_
it as their own.  The GNU copyleft is designed to prevent that sort
of thing.

______
Dennis

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Re: -mwindows copyright?

[PositivePi]

i dont want a copyright.
i dont want my software to be licensed and restricted on a basis of wether 
the end user wants to sell it or modify it or redistrubite it.
if someone wants to use my code in something else, or even sell it, that is 
absolutely cool with me.  id appreciate an email or some credit or something, 
but if they dont want to give it, thats fine.  my goal here isnt to get fame 
and money.  my goal is to distribute a program and some code to the internet 
community that i think other people might find useful.
and i think that if some other developer actually does take interest in my 
code, they will appreciate the freedom i have given them to use my code in 
whatever way the choose, be it to keep it public domain, copyright it, put it 
under gnu, or sell it.


Aaron

In a message dated 7/16/1999 3:21:14 PM Central Daylight Time, 
DMcCunney@roper.com writes:

> Er, Public Domain explicitly means _no_ copyright.
>  
>  Why is distributing under the GNU liscense a problem?  The trouble
>  with releasing software into the public domain is that anyone is
>  free to pick it up, make their own changes, copyright it, and _sell_
>  it as their own.  The GNU copyleft is designed to prevent that sort
>  of thing.

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Re: -mwindows copyright?

[Joshua Rosen]

PositivePi@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi..
> 
>   I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile my program.  I'm
> also binding to several other windows libs such as -lwsock32.  I want to
> distribute my programs--as well as source--entirely public domain.  The
> copyright on all of the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok
> there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, some of them have
> copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
> --snip--
> ;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
> ;
> ;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
> ;
> ;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
> ;   Date: 1996
> ;
> ;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
> ;
> ;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
> ;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
> ;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
> ;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
> --snip--
> Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either have to distribute
> my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for windows API? (which I
> imagine would be a minor pain)

If you read the LGPL, it's explained pretty clearly that, so long as
your work doesn't *contain* parts of GPL'd code (or X-licensed code
from someone else), your work isn't a `derivative work', and is in no
way affected by the license of another work (unless, of course, the
other work has a license that specifies `things that make use of this
tool...', which the LGPL doesn't).

If you link statically (the linker copies the libraries into your
executable), then the *executable* is a derivative work, and gets the
GPL. DLL's are, however, by definition, *dynamically* linked (which is
to say, `not statically linked;)').

If you're distributing source code that doesn't include GPL'd code,
then just forget about the licensing issues and get on with it--you're
safe.
If you're distributing binaries (of a programme, not a library), then
it shouldn't really matter whether the *binaries* are GPL'd or public
domain--they seem to be pretty much the same thing, in that case,
because there's not a lot that one can typically do to create
derivative works of the binary (unless one is into hacking on machine
code).

		-Rozzin.

. o O ( one could convert the machine code to code for a different
architecture.... Isn't the `machine code' effectively `source code',
then? Oh my..., what thoughts.... )

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Re: -mwindows copyright?

[Chris Faylor]

On Fri, Jul 16, 1999 at 04:05:57PM -0400, PositivePi@aol.com wrote:
>  I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile my program.  I'm 
>also binding to several other windows libs such as -lwsock32.  I want to 
>distribute my programs--as well as source--entirely public domain.  The 
>copyright on all of the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok 
>there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, some of them have 
>copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
>--snip--
>;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
>;
>;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
>;
>;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
>;   Date: 1996
>;   
>;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
>;
>;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
>;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
>;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
>;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
>--snip--
>Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either have to distribute 
>my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for windows API? (which I 
>imagine would be a minor pain)

I am not a lawyer, but I'm fairly certain that the fact that the include
files and libraries provide interface information for an existing
interface means that you're ok.  I.e, you don't have to release your
program under the GPL because nothing that you're linking into it can
legally be caused to make it GPL.

When DJ returns from vacation he'll probably have a more definitive opinion.

cgf

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-mwindows copyright?

[PositivePi]

Hi..

  I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile my program.  I'm 
also binding to several other windows libs such as -lwsock32.  I want to 
distribute my programs--as well as source--entirely public domain.  The 
copyright on all of the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok 
there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, some of them have 
copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
--snip--
;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
;
;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
;
;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
;   Date: 1996
;   
;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
;
;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
--snip--
Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either have to distribute 
my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for windows API? (which I 
imagine would be a minor pain)

Aaron

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Re: -mwindows copyright?

[Joshua Rosen]

PositivePi@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi..
> 
>   I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile my program.  I'm
> also binding to several other windows libs such as -lwsock32.  I want to
> distribute my programs--as well as source--entirely public domain.  The
> copyright on all of the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok
> there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, some of them have
> copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
> --snip--
> ;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
> ;
> ;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
> ;
> ;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
> ;   Date: 1996
> ;
> ;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
> ;
> ;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
> ;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
> ;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
> ;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
> --snip--
> Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either have to distribute
> my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for windows API? (which I
> imagine would be a minor pain)

If you read the LGPL, it's explained pretty clearly that, so long as
your work doesn't *contain* parts of GPL'd code (or X-licensed code
from someone else), your work isn't a `derivative work', and is in no
way affected by the license of another work (unless, of course, the
other work has a license that specifies `things that make use of this
tool...', which the LGPL doesn't).

If you link statically (the linker copies the libraries into your
executable), then the *executable* is a derivative work, and gets the
GPL. DLL's are, however, by definition, *dynamically* linked (which is
to say, `not statically linked;)').

If you're distributing source code that doesn't include GPL'd code,
then just forget about the licensing issues and get on with it--you're
safe.
If you're distributing binaries (of a programme, not a library), then
it shouldn't really matter whether the *binaries* are GPL'd or public
domain--they seem to be pretty much the same thing, in that case,
because there's not a lot that one can typically do to create
derivative works of the binary (unless one is into hacking on machine
code).

		-Rozzin.

. o O ( one could convert the machine code to code for a different
architecture.... Isn't the `machine code' effectively `source code',
then? Oh my..., what thoughts.... )

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Re: -mwindows copyright?

[Chris Faylor]

On Fri, Jul 16, 1999 at 04:05:57PM -0400, PositivePi@aol.com wrote:
>  I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile my program.  I'm 
>also binding to several other windows libs such as -lwsock32.  I want to 
>distribute my programs--as well as source--entirely public domain.  The 
>copyright on all of the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok 
>there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, some of them have 
>copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
>--snip--
>;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
>;
>;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
>;
>;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
>;   Date: 1996
>;   
>;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
>;
>;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
>;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
>;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
>;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
>--snip--
>Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either have to distribute 
>my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for windows API? (which I 
>imagine would be a minor pain)

I am not a lawyer, but I'm fairly certain that the fact that the include
files and libraries provide interface information for an existing
interface means that you're ok.  I.e, you don't have to release your
program under the GPL because nothing that you're linking into it can
legally be caused to make it GPL.

When DJ returns from vacation he'll probably have a more definitive opinion.

cgf

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Re: -mwindows copyright?

[PositivePi]

i dont want a copyright.
i dont want my software to be licensed and restricted on a basis of wether 
the end user wants to sell it or modify it or redistrubite it.
if someone wants to use my code in something else, or even sell it, that is 
absolutely cool with me.  id appreciate an email or some credit or something, 
but if they dont want to give it, thats fine.  my goal here isnt to get fame 
and money.  my goal is to distribute a program and some code to the internet 
community that i think other people might find useful.
and i think that if some other developer actually does take interest in my 
code, they will appreciate the freedom i have given them to use my code in 
whatever way the choose, be it to keep it public domain, copyright it, put it 
under gnu, or sell it.


Aaron

In a message dated 7/16/1999 3:21:14 PM Central Daylight Time, 
DMcCunney@roper.com writes:

> Er, Public Domain explicitly means _no_ copyright.
>  
>  Why is distributing under the GNU liscense a problem?  The trouble
>  with releasing software into the public domain is that anyone is
>  free to pick it up, make their own changes, copyright it, and _sell_
>  it as their own.  The GNU copyleft is designed to prevent that sort
>  of thing.

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-mwindows copyright?

[PositivePi]

Hi..

  I'm using the -mno-cygwin and -mwindows options to compile my program.  I'm 
also binding to several other windows libs such as -lwsock32.  I want to 
distribute my programs--as well as source--entirely public domain.  The 
copyright on all of the mingw libraries seems to be public domain, so I'm ok 
there.  But looking at the windows libraries in the source, some of them have 
copyrights such as winsup/sysdef/wsock32.def:
--snip--
;   Exports for WSOCK32 DLL
;
;   Copyright (C) 1996 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
;
;   Author:  Scott Christley <scottc@net-community.com>
;   Date: 1996
;   
;   This file is part of the Windows32 API Library.
;
;   This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
;   modify it under the terms of the GNU Library General Public
;   License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
;   version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
--snip--
Does this mean that if I use -mwindows/-lwsock32 I either have to distribute 
my program under GNU, or write my own .def's for windows API? (which I 
imagine would be a minor pain)

Aaron

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