Re: Degrading tty behaviour

Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

Corinna Vinschen wrote:
 > Unfortunately your mail sounds just like ranting without providing
 > any detail, so I will trash it.

Why do you assume this? What was it about my mail that made you think this? 
I would genuinely like to know. The posting certainly wasn't meant as a 
rant and its this sort of repsonse that makes it difficult to work with the 
cygwin developers.

 > I'm using vim-5.8 all day long and I'm using CYGWIN=tty setting from
 > a ssh connection to the NT box. I have also just tried it with CYGWIN=tty
 > from a cmd window. Works for me (except from mutt which I can reproduce).

And I cannot use vim-5.8 because of this problem. Removing tty from my 
CYGWIN environment fixes it - which seems pretty compelling evidence to me. 
This is true on both NT and W2K. Note that it *does* work from a cmd 
window, it *doesn't* work from a cygwin bash window. Surely using a ssh 
connection to the NT box is not a reasonable test given that it is 
shell/window dependant?

What more details would you like to see? Did you try C-c'ing a java process 
from within bash also?

Thanks

andy




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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Corinna Vinschen]

On Tue, Jul 24, 2001 at 03:28:42PM -0700, Andy Piper wrote:
> 
> Corinna Vinschen wrote:
>  > Unfortunately your mail sounds just like ranting without providing
>  > any detail, so I will trash it.
> 
> Why do you assume this? What was it about my mail that made you think this? 
> I would genuinely like to know. The posting certainly wasn't meant as a 
> rant and its this sort of repsonse that makes it difficult to work with the 
> cygwin developers.

Quote: "The behaviour of apps under CYGWIN=tty appears to be bitrotting
        (for instance try using the current vi and cygwin with this
	setting - its totally impossible)"

What exactly at this sentence gives me (or any other active cygwin
developer) any detail to work with?

"It doesn't work" will not give you any helpful response on any
mailing list, especially when combined with snide comments.

>  > I'm using vim-5.8 all day long and I'm using CYGWIN=tty setting from
>  > a ssh connection to the NT box. I have also just tried it with CYGWIN=tty
>  > from a cmd window. Works for me (except from mutt which I can reproduce).
> 
> And I cannot use vim-5.8 because of this problem. Removing tty from my 
> CYGWIN environment fixes it - which seems pretty compelling evidence to me. 

Fine. What next? I told you I can't reproduce that. That's still true.
What details can you provide except for "it doesn't work". What exactly
doesn't work? You didn't even mention that!

The next sentence in your mail begins with: "C-c behaviour is also broken..."
So your first sentence is not related to a non-functional C-c. So what
is it what doesn't work?

> This is true on both NT and W2K. Note that it *does* work from a cmd 
> window, it *doesn't* work from a cygwin bash window. Surely using a ssh 
> connection to the NT box is not a reasonable test given that it is 
> shell/window dependant?
> 
> What more details would you like to see? Did you try C-c'ing a java process 
> from within bash also?

I have not the faintest idea about java. So the answer is no, I never
started any java application from a Cygwin shell nor from cmd.

Corinna

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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Peter Buckley]

Andy, 

about this C-c'ing a java process from within bash- 
This was recently discussed with a subject like "ctrl break handling 
in bash and java" or something (IIRC). I don't remember the specific
message, but search the archives with google. The general gist of the 
problem was that cygwin treats C-c the same as CTRL-BREAK and that was 
bad for java processes started/stopped from the cygwin bash shell. 
Apparently the C-c from cygwin bash killed the java process without 
letting it clean up- it was an interesting discussion.

HTH,
Peter

Corrina- 

I wasn't clear about the part in your mail that was in response 
to Andy's question about ssh being a reasonable test- Did you try 
it without using ssh?

>>Corinna>> "I told you I can't reproduce that. That's still true."

>>Andy>> "Surely using a ssh connection to the NT box is not a reasonable test given that it is shell/window dependant?"


> What more details would you like to see? Did you try C-c'ing a java process
> from within bash also?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> andy
> 
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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

At 04:49 PM 7/25/01 -0400, Peter Buckley wrote:
>about this C-c'ing a java process from within bash-
>This was recently discussed with a subject like "ctrl break handling
>in bash and java" or something (IIRC). I don't remember the specific
>message, but search the archives with google. The general gist of the
>problem was that cygwin treats C-c the same as CTRL-BREAK and that was
>bad for java processes started/stopped from the cygwin bash shell.
>Apparently the C-c from cygwin bash killed the java process without
>letting it clean up- it was an interesting discussion.

Thanks

andy


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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Corinna Vinschen]

On Wed, Jul 25, 2001 at 04:49:03PM -0400, Peter Buckley wrote:
> Corrina- 
> 
> I wasn't clear about the part in your mail that was in response 
> to Andy's question about ssh being a reasonable test- Did you try 
> it without using ssh?

Yes, I did. And I tried it today again. I have absolutely no
problem to use vim-5.8 in a console window with CYGWIN=tty.

Corinna

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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Corinna Vinschen]

On Fri, Jul 27, 2001 at 07:22:37PM -0700, Andy Piper wrote:
> Corinna, what do you have TERM set to?

In xterm "xterm", in the cmd window "cygwin".

Corinna

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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

Corinna, what do you have TERM set to?

Thanks

andy


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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

Corinna Vinschen <cygwin at cygwin dot com> writes

 > Yes, it it. Perhaps you missed my announcement? I wrote this
 > (including the `==' lines):

 > into the announcement. Don't you have ncurses installed, perhaps?

Seems unlikely that vim would come up at all if I didn't n'est pas? :)
It also seems unlikely that cygcheck would be able to find the ncurses 
packages.

 > Oh, and, btw, _if_ you missed the announcement, ctags is an own
 > package now as it's usual now since vim-5.8 and ctags-5.0.1

I always install everything - unless of course something doesn't work :)

andy


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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Corinna Vinschen]

On Wed, Jul 25, 2001 at 04:41:29PM -0700, Andy Piper wrote:
> Earnie Boyd writes:
> 
>  > What does the output of `cygcheck vim' give?
> 
> vim 5.8:
> 
> SHALOM andyp> cygcheck vim
> Found: E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
> E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
>    E:\cygwin\bin\cygwin1.dll
>      E:\WINNT\System32\KERNEL32.dll
>        E:\WINNT\System32\ntdll.dll
>    E:\cygwin\bin\cygncurses5.dll
> 
> vim 5.7:
> 
> SHALOM andyp> cygcheck vim
> Found: E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
> E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
>    E:\cygwin\bin\cygwin1.dll
>      E:\WINNT\System32\KERNEL32.dll
>        E:\WINNT\System32\ntdll.dll
> 
> So I guess it got built with ncurses latterly?

Yes, it it. Perhaps you missed my announcement? I wrote this
(including the `==' lines):

===========================================================
    vim-5.8-1 depends on an installed ncurses package!
===========================================================

into the announcement. Don't you have ncurses installed, perhaps?

Oh, and, btw, _if_ you missed the announcement, ctags is an own
package now as it's usual now since vim-5.8 and ctags-5.0.1.

Corinna

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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

Earnie Boyd writes:

 > What does the output of `cygcheck vim' give?

vim 5.8:

SHALOM andyp> cygcheck vim
Found: E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
   E:\cygwin\bin\cygwin1.dll
     E:\WINNT\System32\KERNEL32.dll
       E:\WINNT\System32\ntdll.dll
   E:\cygwin\bin\cygncurses5.dll

vim 5.7:

SHALOM andyp> cygcheck vim
Found: E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
E:\cygwin\bin\vim.exe
   E:\cygwin\bin\cygwin1.dll
     E:\WINNT\System32\KERNEL32.dll
       E:\WINNT\System32\ntdll.dll

So I guess it got built with ncurses latterly?

andy


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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

Corinna Vinschen <cygwin at cygwin dot com> wrote:
 > Fine. What next? I told you I can't reproduce that. That's still true.
 > What details can you provide except for "it doesn't work". What exactly
 > doesn't work? You didn't even mention that!

My mistake. vim comes up but then any user input just makes it beep. For 
instance Esc : q yields <beep> <beep> <beep>. I have to C-z and then kill 
it to get out. The build of vim 5.7.x works fine.

 > The next sentence in your mail begins with: "C-c behaviour is also 
broken..."
 > So your first sentence is not related to a non-functional C-c. So what
 > is it what doesn't work?

I have reported this before. If you run a java program within bash and try 
to C-c it, everything is fine. If you try to run a java program within a 
shell-script within bash it is uninteruptible. C-z however does still work. 
This is only true with CYGWIN=tty, without this everything is fine.

I only mention java because it is the one clearly reproducible problem from 
a bunch of C-c issues I have when using CYGWIN=tty and bash.

Thanks

andy


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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Earnie Boyd]

Andy,

What does the output of `cygcheck vim' give?

Earnie.

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Re: Degrading tty behaviour

[Corinna Vinschen]

On Mon, Jun 04, 2001 at 07:43:35PM -0700, Andy Piper wrote:
> The behaviour of apps under CYGWIN=tty appears to be bitrotting (for 
> instance try using the current vi and cygwin with this setting - its 
> totally impossible). 

I'm using vim-5.8 all day long and I'm using CYGWIN=tty setting from
a ssh connection to the NT box. I have also just tried it with CYGWIN=tty
from a cmd window. Works for me (except from mutt which I can reproduce).

Unfortunately your mail sounds just like ranting without providing
any detail, so I will trash it.

Corinna

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Degrading tty behaviour

[Andy Piper]

The behaviour of apps under CYGWIN=tty appears to be bitrotting (for 
instance try using the current vi and cygwin with this setting - its 
totally impossible). C-c behaviour is also broken using this (for instance 
start java inside a shell script and try and interrupt it). Is this option 
no longer functional? XEmacs used to rely on it for correct pty control. Is 
this still the case?

andy


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