RE: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

RE: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[kevin.lawton]

Okay, I spent some time looking at the mailing list archives but found nothing which added anything to this discussion. I would have hoped that my intended offer of use of an Athlon 64 system would have counted as more than just 'idle curiosity' and, anyway, I'm never 'idle'. 
Quite honestly, I wondered what 64-bit op system you were hoping to test on. As I said: it all seems to be okay running Win-32 on an AMD-64, and I've not seen 64-bit Windoze around yet. 
I would be surprised if you were planning on a Linux version of cygwin for obvious reasons, and AFAIK BeOS, PetrOS, Lindows, Plan9, etc, etc, haven't got 64-bit versions out yet. 
Anyway, you've made your point: why should you spend a minute or so telling me something you already know when, with one simple put-down, you can suggest I go search through archives for an hour ?  Fine ! Nice attitude, mate ! 
BTW My plan was to either test for you (under direction) or make the machine available to you via some sort of terminal server and my ADSL connection. I didn't fancy having it transported. I did actually want to contribute something to the cygwin project, as I've found it so valuable over the past couple of years. Shame you weren't interested. Bye.   
   
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Faylor
[mailto:cgf-no-personal-reply-please@cygwin.com]
Sent: 31 October 2003 17:00
To: cygwin@cygwin.com
Subject: Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 04:30:00PM -0000, kevin.lawton@bt.com wrote:
>You expect cygwin NOT to run on an Athlon 64 system ?  How so ?  Under
>what operating system ?  Under 32-bit Windoze, nothing seems any
>different - you're not planning a Linux version of cygwin, are you ?

Hmm.  It seems like a search of the mailing list archives would be a
pretty simple way of satisfying this kind of idle curiousity.

cgf

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Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Christopher Faylor]

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 06:13:17PM -0000, kevin.lawton@bt.com wrote:
>Okay, I spent some time looking at the mailing list archives but found
>nothing which added anything to this discussion.  I would have hoped
>that my intended offer of use of an Athlon 64 system would have counted
>as more than just 'idle curiosity' and, anyway, I'm never 'idle'.

I interpreted your response as nonserious since you seemed to be
humorously suggesting that we'd be working on a version of cygwin for
linux, which is obviously nonsensical.  I thought it was self evident
that I was talking about getting cygwin working on a 64 bit version of
windows and didn't seriously think that you were suggesting that we were
thinking about getting cygwin working on some other system.  I guess
I was wrong.

>BTW My plan was to either test for you (under direction) or make the
>machine available to you via some sort of terminal server and my ADSL
>connection.  I didn't fancy having it transported.  I did actually want
>to contribute something to the cygwin project, as I've found it so
>valuable over the past couple of years.  Shame you weren't interested.

Actually, while I appreciate that you wanted to contribute something,
I'm not interested in either scenario.  The effort of working on cygwin
remotely either by having someone else do testing (especially when the
someone doesn't really know cygwin internals) or by logging in over
the internet was not what I was looking for.  Having a system sitting
in my office that I could hack on when the mood hit me was more of what
I was looking for.

I wasn't seriously suggesting that anyone was going to send me a 64-bit
system, either.

Here's the kind of google search term I would have used to find
discussion:

64-bit windows cygwin site:cygwin.com cgf

This was my first tray and it unearths some discussion as the first hit.
I'm sure that there are search refinements possible but, to answer your
aggrieved question, all of the discussions basically revolve around
someone reporting that cygwin doesn't work right in some beta or release
candidate version of windows for 64 bit platforms and my suggesting that
the problem won't be solved until I (or Corinna or Pierre) have a 64 bit
system to hack on.

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Cygwin on Lindows (was Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money)

[Linda W.]

Christopher Faylor wrote:

>... suggesting that we'd be working on a version of cygwin for
>linux, 
>
---
    Yeah...I was wondering when there'd be a version available on Lindows. 

I'll volunteer to do counting of linux system calls in the 
cygwin-on-lindows-win-layer-on-linux-find vs. native linux find!

-linda
:-)


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Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Christopher Faylor]

On Mon, Nov 03, 2003 at 11:05:08AM -0000, kevin.lawton@bt.com wrote:
>When I have a 64-bit Windoze installed on one of my systems I'll let
>you know.

You don't have to let me know anything.  I'm really not interested in a
remote solution.  This requires a machine that I can power cycle and
have next to my desk for an extended length of time.

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RE: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[kevin.lawton]

-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Faylor
[mailto:cgf-no-personal-reply-please@cygwin.com]
Sent: 31 October 2003 18:58
To: cygwin@cygwin.com
Subject: Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money


On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 06:13:17PM -0000, kevin.lawton@bt.com wrote:
>Okay, I spent some time looking at the mailing list archives but found
>nothing which added anything to this discussion.  I would have hoped
>that my intended offer of use of an Athlon 64 system would have counted
>as more than just 'idle curiosity' and, anyway, I'm never 'idle'.

I interpreted your response as nonserious since you seemed to be
humorously suggesting that we'd be working on a version of cygwin for
linux, which is obviously nonsensical.  I thought it was self evident
that I was talking about getting cygwin working on a 64 bit version of
windows and didn't seriously think that you were suggesting that we were
thinking about getting cygwin working on some other system.  I guess
I was wrong.
I didn't realise that 64-bit windoze was actually available as yet, so I guessed you were thinking of something else. 
Just because the 'Cygwin on Linux' bit was a joke (and a pretty obvious one at that), doesn't mean the rest wasn't serious. I notice someone else has mentioned 'Cygwin on Lindows', which I find even funnier.     ROFL 

>BTW My plan was to either test for you (under direction) or make the
>machine available to you via some sort of terminal server and my ADSL
>connection.  I didn't fancy having it transported.  I did actually want
>to contribute something to the cygwin project, as I've found it so
>valuable over the past couple of years.  Shame you weren't interested.

Actually, while I appreciate that you wanted to contribute something,
I'm not interested in either scenario.  The effort of working on cygwin
remotely either by having someone else do testing (especially when the
someone doesn't really know cygwin internals) or by logging in over
the internet was not what I was looking for.  Having a system sitting
in my office that I could hack on when the mood hit me was more of what
I was looking for. 
I know from experience that working remotely via M$ terminal server and an ADSL line is close enough to being on the machine itself as to make negligible difference in most cases. Maybe not with cygwin - I'll give it a try. 

I wasn't seriously suggesting that anyone was going to send me a 64-bit
system, either. 
I get the felling that you are not exactly 'local' to me, or I'd have been considering lending one for a while. 

Here's the kind of google search term I would have used to find
discussion:

64-bit windows cygwin site:cygwin.com cgf

This was my first tray and it unearths some discussion as the first hit.
I'm sure that there are search refinements possible but, to answer your
aggrieved question, all of the discussions basically revolve around
someone reporting that cygwin doesn't work right in some beta or release
candidate version of windows for 64 bit platforms and my suggesting that
the problem won't be solved until I (or Corinna or Pierre) have a 64 bit
system to hack on. 
When I have a 64-bit Windoze installed on one of my systems I'll let you know. 
Kevin. 

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Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Christopher Faylor]

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 04:30:00PM -0000, kevin.lawton@bt.com wrote:
>You expect cygwin NOT to run on an Athlon 64 system ?  How so ?  Under
>what operating system ?  Under 32-bit Windoze, nothing seems any
>different - you're not planning a Linux version of cygwin, are you ?

Hmm.  It seems like a search of the mailing list archives would be a
pretty simple way of satisfying this kind of idle curiousity.

cgf

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RE: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[kevin.lawton]

cgf, 
You expect cygwin NOT to run on an Athlon 64 system ?   How so ?   Under what operating system ? 
Under 32-bit Windoze, nothing seems any different - you're not planning a Linux version of cygwin, are you ? 
Kevin.   
   
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Faylor
[mailto:cgf-no-personal-reply-please@cygwin.com]
Sent: 31 October 2003 16:17
To: cygwin@cygwin.com
Subject: Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 07:23:47AM -0800, Karl M wrote:
>Hi All...
>
>What a relief...I thought that Cygwin had the PBS virus (doesn't do any 
>harm, but periodically asks for money).

I'm sure that there any cygwin developer would gratefully accept
(without even any thoughtful consideration) a token of appreciation but
it certainly isn't a requirement by any stretch of the imagination.  I
do occasionally suggest a Red Hat support contract for someone who is
clamoring for a bug fix, though.

I have been half-seriously asking for someone to send me a 64 bit Athlon
or Opteron system so that I could investigate getting cygwin running
there.  But, while I wistfully watch the UPS guy drive by my house every
day, he never seems to stop to drop off a big package at my door.

And, don't get me started (again) on my laptop embroglio...

cgf

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Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Christopher Faylor]

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 07:23:47AM -0800, Karl M wrote:
>Hi All...
>
>What a relief...I thought that Cygwin had the PBS virus (doesn't do any 
>harm, but periodically asks for money).

I'm sure that there any cygwin developer would gratefully accept
(without even any thoughtful consideration) a token of appreciation but
it certainly isn't a requirement by any stretch of the imagination.  I
do occasionally suggest a Red Hat support contract for someone who is
clamoring for a bug fix, though.

I have been half-seriously asking for someone to send me a 64 bit Athlon
or Opteron system so that I could investigate getting cygwin running
there.  But, while I wistfully watch the UPS guy drive by my house every
day, he never seems to stop to drop off a big package at my door.

And, don't get me started (again) on my laptop embroglio...

cgf

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Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Karl M]

Hi All...

What a relief...I thought that Cygwin had the PBS virus (doesn't do any 
harm, but periodically asks for money).

...Karl


>From: Christopher Faylor <cgf-no-personal-reply-please@cygwin.com>
>Reply-To: cygwin@cygwin.com
>To: cygwin@cygwin.com
>Subject: Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money
>Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 10:15:17 -0500
>
>On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 07:37:22AM -0500, Brian Kelly wrote:
> >> You can donate money.
> >
> >Fair enough.
>
>I was not asking for money.  I was responding to your prosaic
>description of an unrelated problem to show that it was a completely
>different problem domain.  Perseverence in getting someone to donate
>money or books could yield success.  Perseverence in reporting that you
>have a problem while providing no details for tracking the problem down
>and adamantly maintaining that you will not be able to debug the problem
>yourself is not useful.
>
>I'm not even going to put an "IMO" in there because it should be pretty
>obvious to anyone that lives in the world that repeatedly complaining
>about intractable problems rarely yields positive results.
>
>cgf
>
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Re: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Christopher Faylor]

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 07:37:22AM -0500, Brian Kelly wrote:
>> You can donate money. 
>
>Fair enough.

I was not asking for money.  I was responding to your prosaic
description of an unrelated problem to show that it was a completely
different problem domain.  Perseverence in getting someone to donate
money or books could yield success.  Perseverence in reporting that you
have a problem while providing no details for tracking the problem down
and adamantly maintaining that you will not be able to debug the problem
yourself is not useful.

I'm not even going to put an "IMO" in there because it should be pretty
obvious to anyone that lives in the world that repeatedly complaining
about intractable problems rarely yields positive results.

cgf

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RE: cygwin deadlocks due to lack of money

[Brian Kelly]

> You can donate money. 

Fair enough.

How? I saw nothing on the cygwin website explaining how this could be
done. I'd want donations used explicitly for cygwin.

BK

-----Original Message-----
From: cygwin-owner@cygwin.com [mailto:cygwin-owner@cygwin.com] On Behalf
Of Christopher Faylor
Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 1:33 AM
To: cygwin@cygwin.com
Subject: Re: cygwin deadlocks due to broken select() when writing to
pipes

On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:59:17AM -0500, Brian Kelly wrote:
>Nevertheless, a few persistent reminders over a long period can have
>the same effect as a very large number of complaints in close
>proximity.
>
>There was once a great story in the Reader's Digest I think of some
>prisoner somewhere who decided that it'd be nice to have a new library
>in the prison.  So he started writing lawmakers and telling them that
>he wanted a new library for the prison.  Every day he mailed a couple
>of dozen hand written letters.  For three of four years they were
>ignored.  Then eventually he started getting VERY nasty responses
>telling him to bug off.  Some even called the warden to get him to
>stop, but civil libertarians soon took interest in this and threatened
>to sue on his behalf if his mail was censured.  Finally everyone was
>eventually worn down and around year ten, the legislature voted to fund
>the construction of his library - allocating close to TWO MILLION
>DOLLARS for the effort.

You can buy books.  You can donate money.  You can't cause a problem to
be solved just by incessantly complaining about it.

If this technique was uniformly useful then we'd have peace in the
Middle East and my son would have a telephone in his room.

cgf

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