Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Matt Seitz (matseitz)]

"Yaakov (Cygwin/X)" wrote:
> 
> xorg-server is not specified as a runtime dependency of libX11 or
libxcb
> for several reasons:

Should xorg-server be specified as a runtime dependency of gitk?



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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Corinna Vinschen]

On Feb 24 11:26, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
> "Yaakov (Cygwin/X)" wrote:
> > 
> > xorg-server is not specified as a runtime dependency of libX11 or
> libxcb
> > for several reasons:
> 
> Should xorg-server be specified as a runtime dependency of gitk?

The X server is no hard requirement.  Consider:

  $ DISPLAY=my_linux_box:0 gitk&


Corinna

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Corinna Vinschen                  Please, send mails regarding Cygwin to
Cygwin Project Co-Leader          cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Red Hat

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Matt Seitz (matseitz)]

"Yaakov (Cygwin/X)" wrote: 
> 
> Remember that using X requires some level of manual intervention,
namely
> that you have to *start* the server and set DISPLAY before actually
> using it.  
> So installing xorg-server as a dependency isn't going to
> prevent these questions one bit.

Good point.  Would adding "xinit" as a dependency be a better solution?

I am hoping that when "setup" informs the user that "gitk requires
xinit", it might it at least:

1.  Alert the user to the fact that gitk now requires loading the X
server.  
2.  Spare the user having to run "setup" again to download the packages
they need.



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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Yaakov (Cygwin/X)]

On Fri, 2012-02-24 at 14:43 -0800, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
> "Larry Hall (Cygwin)" wrote:
> > 
> > Nobody that doesn't need or want it has to install the X-Server.  If
> > one uses gitk though, one has now moved into the category of "need/want
> > the X-Server" if one wasn't already in that category. ;-)
> 
> Well, they certainly will need/want AN X-Server.  But I thought
> Corrina's point was that in some cases that X-Server does not have to be
> the Cygwin xorg-server (could be a different local X-Server, or even a
> remote X-Server).
> 
> My question is:  are there enough gitk users who would need/want the
> Cygwin xorg-server that it would be worth installing xorg-server by
> default when installing gitk, even though some gitk users may not
> actually need the Cygwin xorg-server?

Remember that using X requires some level of manual intervention, namely
that you have to *start* the server and set DISPLAY before actually
using it.  So installing xorg-server as a dependency isn't going to
prevent these questions one bit.


Yaakov



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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Larry Hall (Cygwin)]

On 2/24/2012 6:37 PM, Mike Kaganski wrote:
> 25.02.2012 9:53, Larry Hall (Cygwin) пишет:
>> On 2/24/2012 5:43 PM, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
>>> My question is: are there enough gitk users who would need/want the
>>> Cygwin xorg-server that it would be worth installing xorg-server by
>>> default when installing gitk, even though some gitk users may not
>>> actually need the Cygwin xorg-server?
>>
>> I would be for adding Cygiwn's xorg-server as a dependency for any
>> package that needs an X-Server to be generally useful.
>>
> Probably xorg-server could be made a conditional dependency (not sure if
> cygwin supports these), e.g. triggered by a registry value or env setting,
> and it could be enabled by default, while some users could configure it to
> tell the installer that they use some external X-Server?

"setup.exe" doesn't support conditional dependencies but for those that
would prefer to install/use another X-Server, I'm sure they can figure
out how to tell "setup.exe" not to install Cygwin's X-Server.  I'm sure
the facility you're talking about could be added to "setup.exe" if someone
were interested in providing patches to enable this though.

-- 
Larry

_____________________________________________________________________

A: Yes.
 > Q: Are you sure?
 >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
 >>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Mike Kaganski]

25.02.2012 9:53, Larry Hall (Cygwin) пишет:
> On 2/24/2012 5:43 PM, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
>> My question is: are there enough gitk users who would need/want the
>> Cygwin xorg-server that it would be worth installing xorg-server by
>> default when installing gitk, even though some gitk users may not
>> actually need the Cygwin xorg-server?
>
> I would be for adding Cygiwn's xorg-server as a dependency for any
> package that needs an X-Server to be generally useful.
>
Probably xorg-server could be made a conditional dependency (not sure if 
cygwin supports these), e.g. triggered by a registry value or env 
setting, and it could be enabled by default, while some users could 
configure it to tell the installer that they use some external X-Server?

-- 
Best regards, Mike.


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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Larry Hall (Cygwin)]

On 2/24/2012 5:43 PM, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
> "Larry Hall (Cygwin)" wrote:
>>
>> Nobody that doesn't need or want it has to install the X-Server.  If
>> one uses gitk though, one has now moved into the category of
> "need/want
>> the X-Server" if one wasn't already in that category. ;-)
>
> Well, they certainly will need/want AN X-Server.  But I thought
> Corrina's point was that in some cases that X-Server does not have to be
> the Cygwin xorg-server (could be a different local X-Server, or even a
> remote X-Server).

True enough, though I expect for most Cygwin users, this is the exception
and not the rule.

> My question is:  are there enough gitk users who would need/want the
> Cygwin xorg-server that it would be worth installing xorg-server by
> default when installing gitk, even though some gitk users may not
> actually need the Cygwin xorg-server?

I would be for adding Cygiwn's xorg-server as a dependency for any
package that needs an X-Server to be generally useful.

-- 
Larry

_____________________________________________________________________

A: Yes.
 > Q: Are you sure?
 >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
 >>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Matt Seitz (matseitz)]

"Larry Hall (Cygwin)" wrote:
> 
> Nobody that doesn't need or want it has to install the X-Server.  If
> one uses gitk though, one has now moved into the category of
"need/want
> the X-Server" if one wasn't already in that category. ;-)

Well, they certainly will need/want AN X-Server.  But I thought
Corrina's point was that in some cases that X-Server does not have to be
the Cygwin xorg-server (could be a different local X-Server, or even a
remote X-Server).

My question is:  are there enough gitk users who would need/want the
Cygwin xorg-server that it would be worth installing xorg-server by
default when installing gitk, even though some gitk users may not
actually need the Cygwin xorg-server?


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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Larry Hall (Cygwin)]

On 2/24/2012 3:50 PM, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
> "Corinna Vinschen" wrote:
>   >  On Feb 24 11:26, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
>>>
>>> Should xorg-server be specified as a runtime dependency of gitk?
>>
>> The X server is no hard requirement.  Consider:
>>
>>    $ DISPLAY=my_linux_box:0 gitk&
>
> True.  But would the benefit (helping new users) outweigh the cost
> (installing xorg-server for some users that don't actually require it)?

Nobody that doesn't need or want it has to install the X-Server.  If
one uses gitk though, one has now moved into the category of "need/want
the X-Server" if one wasn't already in that category. ;-)


-- 
Larry

_____________________________________________________________________

A: Yes.
 > Q: Are you sure?
 >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
 >>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Matt Seitz (matseitz)]

"Corinna Vinschen" wrote:
 > On Feb 24 11:26, Matt Seitz (matseitz) wrote:
> > 
> > Should xorg-server be specified as a runtime dependency of gitk?
> 
> The X server is no hard requirement.  Consider:
> 
>   $ DISPLAY=my_linux_box:0 gitk&

True.  But would the benefit (helping new users) outweigh the cost
(installing xorg-server for some users that don't actually require it)?
 

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Yaakov (Cygwin/X)]

On Fri, 2012-02-17 at 23:54 +0100, marco atzeri wrote:
> probably yes, the current setup.ini requires the X DLL's needed but
> not the xorg-server
> 
> Yaakov,
> could you add it ?

xorg-server is not specified as a runtime dependency of libX11 or libxcb
for several reasons:

* not everything that uses libX11 actually needs an X server all the
time (e.g. giflib) or at all (e.g. nas).

* the X11 client-server model allows a choice of X servers, of which
XWin (while preferred) is only one such implementation, or users may
choose a remote connection from another OS (e.g. a Linux box or VM).

Therefore, xorg-server (preferably with xinit) is left to the user to
select for installation.


Yaakov



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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Csaba Raduly]

On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 11:34 PM, Bill Hoffman  wrote:
(snip)
> Hi, just discovered this one myself.  I am wondering why tcl-tk does not
> depend on an xserver now?  Since you can not run tcl-tk without xorg-server,
> seems like setup should install it right?

Technically, you don't *have to* run xorg-server on your Windows machine.

Csaba
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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[marco atzeri]

On 2/17/2012 11:34 PM, Bill Hoffman wrote:
> On 2/11/2012 12:40 AM, marco atzeri wrote:
>> On 2/11/2012 12:02 AM, Arnon Moscona wrote:
>
>> Hi Arnon,
>> because Tk now need the X server.
>>
>> Have you missed ?
>> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-announce/2012-02/msg00011.html
>>
>> See also
>> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-apps/2011-10/msg00083.html
>> for further info
>>
> Hi, just discovered this one myself. I am wondering why tcl-tk does not
> depend on an xserver now? Since you can not run tcl-tk without
> xorg-server, seems like setup should install it right?
>
>
> -Bill

probably yes, the current setup.ini requires the X DLL's needed but
not the xorg-server

@ tcl-tk
sdesc: "Tcl X11 toolkit"
ldesc: "An X11 toolkit implemented with the Tcl scripting language."
category: Interpreters Tcl X11
requires: libfontconfig1 libX11_6 libXft2 libXss1 tcl cygwin

Yaakov,
could you add it ?


Regards
Marco

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Bill Hoffman]

On 2/11/2012 12:40 AM, marco atzeri wrote:
> On 2/11/2012 12:02 AM, Arnon Moscona wrote:

> Hi Arnon,
> because Tk now need the X server.
>
> Have you missed ?
> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-announce/2012-02/msg00011.html
>
> See also
> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-apps/2011-10/msg00083.html
> for further info
>
Hi, just discovered this one myself.  I am wondering why tcl-tk does not 
depend on an xserver now?  Since you can not run tcl-tk without 
xorg-server, seems like setup should install it right?


-Bill

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[marco atzeri]

On 2/11/2012 12:02 AM, Arnon Moscona wrote:
> I just updated cygwin (installing hg), which updated all the packages.
> gitk now fails to start.
>
> I basically get :
>
>
> $Application initialization failed: no display name and no $DISPLAY
> environment variable
> cygwin warning:
>    MS-DOS style path detected: C:\Users\Admin\cygwin\bin\gitk
>    Preferred POSIX equivalent is: /usr/bin/gitk
>    CYGWIN environment variable option "nodosfilewarning" turns off this warning.
>    Consult the user's guide for more details about POSIX paths:
>      http://cygwin.com/cygwin-ug-net/using.html#using-pathnames
> Error in startup script: no display name and no $DISPLAY environment variable
>      while executing
> "load /usr/lib/tk8.5/../../bin/libtk8.5.dll Tk"
>      ("package ifneeded Tk 8.5.11" script)
>      invoked from within
> "package require Tk"
>      (file "C:\Users\Admin\cygwin\bin\gitk" line 11)
>
> [1]+  Exit 1                  gitk --all
>
>
>
>
> Note that I've seen the discussion at
> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2011-08/msg00478.html, but I don't agree
> with the conclusion. I never needed an X server before, and gitk
> displayed fine up until now. So why should I need to run an X server
> now?
>

Hi Arnon,
because Tk now need the X server.

Have you missed ?
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-announce/2012-02/msg00011.html

See also
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-apps/2011-10/msg00083.html
for further info

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Re: gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Matt Seitz (matseitz)]

"Arnon Moscona" <forwardmoscona@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:<CAN0dh0hhiKyPKizU90upoqSWRcKGvAJmqXcDD=eMbmdA34aA5Q@mail.gmail.com
>...
> 
> I never needed an X server before, and gitk
> displayed fine up until now. So why should I need to run an X server
> now?

See:

http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2012-02/msg00115.html




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gitk fails to start after updating cygwin

[Arnon Moscona]

I just updated cygwin (installing hg), which updated all the packages.
gitk now fails to start.

I basically get :


$Application initialization failed: no display name and no $DISPLAY
environment variable
cygwin warning:
  MS-DOS style path detected: C:\Users\Admin\cygwin\bin\gitk
  Preferred POSIX equivalent is: /usr/bin/gitk
  CYGWIN environment variable option "nodosfilewarning" turns off this warning.
  Consult the user's guide for more details about POSIX paths:
    http://cygwin.com/cygwin-ug-net/using.html#using-pathnames
Error in startup script: no display name and no $DISPLAY environment variable
    while executing
"load /usr/lib/tk8.5/../../bin/libtk8.5.dll Tk"
    ("package ifneeded Tk 8.5.11" script)
    invoked from within
"package require Tk"
    (file "C:\Users\Admin\cygwin\bin\gitk" line 11)

[1]+  Exit 1                  gitk --all




Note that I've seen the discussion at
http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2011-08/msg00478.html, but I don't agree
with the conclusion. I never needed an X server before, and gitk
displayed fine up until now. So why should I need to run an X server
now?

-- 
Arnon Moscona
arnon@moscona.com

Sed fugit interea fugit irreparabile tempus, singula dum capti
circumvectamur amore

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