RE: bash and the delete key

["Stephan Mueller" <smueller@Exchange.Microsoft.com>]

I expect that the old keystrokes will probably be supported pretty much
forever (hmm, does Unix still go into all uppercase mode if you enter
your userid in all caps at login?)

I don't know how universal the old cut/copy/paste keystrokes are, but
Ctrl-C/X/V are universal in Windows apps these days.

I wasn't responding to the message you were responding to (about
Insert), I was responding to yours (about Ctrl-Insert, etc.).  You
suggested that the obsolete Windows keystrokes were a good choice for
use in Cygwin because "if a Windows user were to get in the habit of
using them in Windows then they should be able to use the "correct" keys
by habit".  My objection was to the part were you suggested that Windows
users get into the habit of using the obsolete keys in Windows.

stephan(not necessarily reflecting the views of my employer);


-----Original Message-----
From: Samuel [mailto:samuel@socal.rr.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 7:26 AM
To: cygwin@cygwin.com
Subject: Re: bash and the delete key


If I had things my way, I would encourage Microsoft to discontinue
making the transition in the wrong direction. The support of
Shift+Insert,
Ctrl+Insert and Shift+Delete are so universal that I think there would 
Ctrl+be
significant protest if support was discontinued. I understand that you
are advising not to encourage use of them but notice that I responded to
a recomendation to use "Insert" instead of Shift-Insert. I am surprised
that you did not make a comment on use of plain "Insert". Also not that
my reply was for a discussion in which the Microsoft recommendation is
not possible.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephan Mueller" <smueller@Exchange.Microsoft.com>
To: "Samuel" <samuel@socal.rr.com>; <cygwin@cygwin.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 1:11 PM
Subject: RE: bash and the delete key


Please note that the Ctrl-Insert/Shift-Insert/Shift-Delete keystrokes
are legacy, supported for backwards compatibility.  The modern standard
is indeed Ctrl-C/V/X.

From "The Windows Interface Guidelines for Software Design" (covers
Windows 95 and NT! -- so you know it's not brand new :-)

"The system still supports shortcut assignments available in earlier
versions of Microsoft Windows (Alt+Backspace, Shift+Insert,
Ctrl+Insert, Shift+Delete).  You should consider supporting them (though
not documenting them) to support the transition of users."

(This is a footnote in Appendix B, which documents the standard
shortcuts - Ctrl-C/V/X among them).

As long as folks don't actually make the transition, I suspect the OS
will continue to support them, but please, let's not encourage folks to
make the transition in the wrong direction :-)

stephan();



-----Original Message-----
From: Samuel [mailto:samuel@socal.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 1:03 PM
To: cygwin@cygwin.com
Subject: Re: bash and the delete key


----- Original Message -----
From: "Randall R Schulz" <rrschulz@cris.com>
To: <cygwin@cygwin.com>
Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 8:31 PM
Subject: RE: bash and the delete key
>
> Mapping the insert clipboard to the "Insert" key is sufficiently 
> "hella-useful."


I did not pay sufficient attention to what I was doing and this reply
got sent to Randall instead of to the list, so it has been delayed a
day.

I don't use Ctrl-V to insert the clipboard; I use Shift-Insert. I use
Ctrl-Insert to copy to the clipboard and Shift-Delete to cut. These have
been standard since Windows 3.1. I learned to use them by using the
technique of remembering that Ctrl-Insert begins with "C" as in "Copy".
If these keys were used in CygWin and if a Windows user were to get in
the habit of using them in Windows then they should be able to use the
"correct" keys by habit. I have encountered very few situations in which
Ctrl-Insert does not work and in the situations it does not work I did
not even think to try using Ctrl-V. I think that one situation in which
Ctrl-Insert does not work is Adobe Acrobat (the find dialog at least)
and all others are less common; at least less commonly used by me.



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