* Request update of TCL and expect packages @ 2011-10-25 17:37 Craig Miller 2011-10-26 16:50 ` Chris Sutcliffe 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Craig Miller @ 2011-10-25 17:37 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin Hello Chris Sutcliffe & Christopher Faylor, Apparently, I started off on the wrong foot. I apologize to the list. I respectfully request that the expect and TCL packages in the cygwin distro be updated. I have the sources I used (earlier) to create expect version 5.45, and they can be found at: http://www.makikiweb.com/cygwin/tcl/ http://www.makikiweb.com/cygwin/expect/ Thank you in advance, Craig... [author of expect-lite] -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-25 17:37 Request update of TCL and expect packages Craig Miller @ 2011-10-26 16:50 ` Chris Sutcliffe 2011-10-26 20:27 ` Marco Atzeri 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Chris Sutcliffe @ 2011-10-26 16:50 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin On 25 October 2011 13:37, Craig Miller wrote: > Hello Chris Sutcliffe & Christopher Faylor, Not sure how I can help with this, TCL and expect are cgf's domain. Cheers, Chris -- Chris Sutcliffe http://emergedesktop.org http://www.google.com/profiles/ir0nh34d -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-26 16:50 ` Chris Sutcliffe @ 2011-10-26 20:27 ` Marco Atzeri 2011-10-27 18:30 ` Dave 2011-10-27 18:40 ` Craig Miller 0 siblings, 2 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Marco Atzeri @ 2011-10-26 20:27 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin On 10/26/2011 6:50 PM, Chris Sutcliffe wrote: > On 25 October 2011 13:37, Craig Miller wrote: >> Hello Chris Sutcliffe& Christopher Faylor, > > Not sure how I can help with this, TCL and expect are cgf's domain. > > Cheers, > > Chris > After chatting with Craig I dug the archives and I presume the main issue is how to upgrade tcl/tk and all the packages that depend froms it assuming that everything works and nothing is broken. The problem was already mentioned long time ago http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2009-09/msg00311.html http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2009-09/msg00389.html and it is one of the most recorrent ones. There are currently 19 packages depending from tcltk, "brltty" is probably the most sensitive from this point of view. The separation of insight from gdb seems one of the key step that cgf is taking to solve this long time problem http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2011-08/msg00413.html but I have no idea wich are the other blocking points. About expect Cgf was looking long time ago a volunteer http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2008-08/msg00458.html so this package will likely wait the tcltk upgrade Regards Marco -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-26 20:27 ` Marco Atzeri @ 2011-10-27 18:30 ` Dave 2011-10-27 18:43 ` Craig Miller 2011-10-27 18:40 ` Craig Miller 1 sibling, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Dave @ 2011-10-27 18:30 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin On 10/26/2011 3:27 PM, Marco Atzeri wrote: > > After chatting with Craig I dug the archives and > I presume the main issue is how to upgrade tcl/tk > and all the packages that depend froms it > assuming that everything works and nothing is broken. > The problem was already mentioned long time ago > I hope this isn't a dumb question... Since TCL is designed to support multiple versions installed simultaneously, and there are already quite a few Cygwin packages that have dependencies on various versions of libraries, why not have a new TCL85 and EXPECT545 packages? Just leave all the other packages that depend on TCL8.4 alone? Perhaps Mr. Miller would volunteer to be the Cygwin package owner for these two new packages. Even if he were to abandon support, the situation would be better since we'd have >much< more modern versions of TCL/EXPECT for Cygwin. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-27 18:30 ` Dave @ 2011-10-27 18:43 ` Craig Miller 2011-10-27 20:07 ` Charles Wilson 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Craig Miller @ 2011-10-27 18:43 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin Dave, This sounds like a not unreasonable solution (having 2 sets of tcl/expect packages). I can see that there might be a confusion factor for newbies, so it would be good to get a few more opinions. If it is acceptable, I would happily contribute/maintain the TCL 8.5, expect 5.45 packages. regards, Craig... On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 11:37 AM, Dave <iamdave@glidefree.com> wrote: > On 10/26/2011 3:27 PM, Marco Atzeri wrote: >> >> After chatting with Craig I dug the archives and >> I presume the main issue is how to upgrade tcl/tk >> and all the packages that depend froms it >> assuming that everything works and nothing is broken. >> The problem was already mentioned long time ago >> > I hope this isn't a dumb question... > > Since TCL is designed to support multiple versions installed simultaneously, > and there are already quite a few Cygwin packages that have dependencies on > various versions of libraries, why not have a new TCL85 and EXPECT545 > packages? Just leave all the other packages that depend on TCL8.4 alone? > Perhaps Mr. Miller would volunteer to be the Cygwin package owner for these > two new packages. Even if he were to abandon support, the situation would be > better since we'd have >much< more modern versions of TCL/EXPECT for Cygwin. > > > > > -- > Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html > FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ > Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html > Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple > > -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-27 18:43 ` Craig Miller @ 2011-10-27 20:07 ` Charles Wilson 2011-10-27 20:09 ` Charles Wilson 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Charles Wilson @ 2011-10-27 20:07 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin Please don't top-post. Reformatted below. On 10/27/2011 2:43 PM, Craig Miller wrote: > On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 11:37 AM, Dave <iamdave@glidefree.com> wrote: >> I hope this isn't a dumb question... No, it's not a dumb question, but... >> Since TCL is designed to support multiple versions installed simultaneously, >> and there are already quite a few Cygwin packages that have dependencies on >> various versions of libraries, why not have a new TCL85 and EXPECT545 >> packages? Just leave all the other packages that depend on TCL8.4 alone? >> Perhaps Mr. Miller would volunteer to be the Cygwin package owner for these >> two new packages. Even if he were to abandon support, the situation would be >> better since we'd have >much< more modern versions of TCL/EXPECT for Cygwin. > > This sounds like a not unreasonable solution (having 2 sets of > tcl/expect packages). I can see that there might be a confusion factor > for newbies, so it would be good to get a few more opinions. Unfortunately, it's not really possible *right now*. Maybe, going forward, future versions of (e.g.) tcl8.6 could co-exist with the new 8.5 ones [1]. The problem IIRC is that until recent versions (which cygwin-tcltk is /not/), all versions of tcl used the same directory to store their addons. This means that (old) tcl would "see" and attempt to load/use the addons built and configured for (new) tcl. Ditto tk. Also, as detailed below [1], even then there are other issues with the dev files that still aren't fixed in upstream. :-( To make this work (again IIRC) you'd have to backport the relevant changes to cygwin's ancient tcltk packages, and then rebuild them, as well as rebuilding the associated addons so that they go into a non-conflicting location. That's a lot of effort. I gave it a shot several years back -- it kinda sorta worked, but not very well. Now, if the argument is "but I want a GDI version of tk, and you guys are switching to X!" (rather than "I simply LOVE ancient and obsolete technology! tcltk-20080420-1/8.4 forever!!eleventy!11!!") -- then... One alternative would be to build the entire (new) stack with an alternate prefix (such as /opt/tk-gdi/), with the appropriate patches so that tk is pure cygwin + GDI (rather than win32ish + GDI, as the current, ancient, versions are). I doubt this would have much chance to be added to the distro, but you can always set up a repo to share this effort, like Yaakov/cygwin-ports has done. [1] But Yaakov's package naming choice won't allow that to work "smoothly". Basically, the various elements (tcl, tk, itck, etc) would each need to be "broken up" into subpackages. Further, /some/ of those subpackages would need to have "versioned" names -- like we do for so-called "dll" packages -- while other subpackages would need, e.g., alternatives support for conflicting files (e.g. who provides the unversioned "wish.exe" or "tclsh.exe"?). However, lest this be taken as a criticism of Yaakov's packages, the problem is tcl/tk/etc aren't really *set up* for this sort of thing. You'd need additional patches so that the "build" headers (currently in /usr/include/*.h) could be moved to (say, /usr/include/tcl8.5/*.h) -- and tcl itself patched so that add-on builds could "find" them there. It's really a big mess. I posted an attempt at this several years ago, but it requires a lot of patching and fiddling -- and really should be handled by upstream. It's not something distributors -- like Fedora or cygwin -- should take on themselves. Until upstream gets its act together for co-installs... -- Chuck -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-27 20:07 ` Charles Wilson @ 2011-10-27 20:09 ` Charles Wilson 0 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Charles Wilson @ 2011-10-27 20:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin On 10/27/2011 4:07 PM, Charles Wilson wrote: > Please don't top-post. Reformatted below. And don't quote people's email address. > On 10/27/2011 2:43 PM, Craig Miller wrote: >> On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 11:37 AM, Dave <xxx@yyy.zzz> wrote: like we both did. (Sorry, Dave). -- Chuck -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-26 20:27 ` Marco Atzeri 2011-10-27 18:30 ` Dave @ 2011-10-27 18:40 ` Craig Miller 2011-10-27 20:11 ` Charles Wilson 1 sibling, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Craig Miller @ 2011-10-27 18:40 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin Thank you for the additional information, Marco. If it is of any assistance to Christopher Faylor, I believe the tcl/expect and dependent packages have been upgraded on sourceware <ftp://sourceware.org/pub/cygwinports/portslist.txt>, perhaps the upgrade will not be that time consuming. regards, Craig... On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 4:27 PM, Marco Atzeri <marco.atzeri@gmail.com> wrote: > > On 10/26/2011 6:50 PM, Chris Sutcliffe wrote: >> >> On 25 October 2011 13:37, Craig Miller wrote: >>> >>> Hello Chris Sutcliffe& Christopher Faylor, >> >> Not sure how I can help with this, TCL and expect are cgf's domain. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Chris >> > > After chatting with Craig I dug the archives and > I presume the main issue is how to upgrade tcl/tk > and all the packages that depend froms it > assuming that everything works and nothing is broken. > The problem was already mentioned long time ago > > http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2009-09/msg00311.html > http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2009-09/msg00389.html > > and it is one of the most recorrent ones. > > There are currently 19 packages depending from tcltk, > "brltty" is probably the most sensitive from this point of view. > > The separation of insight from gdb seems one of the key step > that cgf is taking to solve this long time problem > http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2011-08/msg00413.html > > but I have no idea wich are the other blocking points. > > About expect Cgf was looking long time ago a volunteer > http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2008-08/msg00458.html > so this package will likely wait the tcltk upgrade > > Regards > Marco > > -- > Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html > FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ > Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html > Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple > -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages 2011-10-27 18:40 ` Craig Miller @ 2011-10-27 20:11 ` Charles Wilson [not found] ` <CAM_o6DVj7UAuit0FNqMhQLe1=GU2ft_cphmcmBQ+PRRPuCBrUA@mail.gmail.com> 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Charles Wilson @ 2011-10-27 20:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: cygwin On 10/27/2011 2:40 PM, Craig Miller wrote: > Thank you for the additional information, Marco. > > If it is of any assistance to Christopher Faylor, I believe the > tcl/expect and dependent packages have been upgraded on sourceware > <ftp://sourceware.org/pub/cygwinports/portslist.txt>, perhaps the > upgrade will not be that time consuming. ATTENTION: Tcl/Tk transition http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-apps/2011-10/msg00083.html -- Chuck -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <CAM_o6DVj7UAuit0FNqMhQLe1=GU2ft_cphmcmBQ+PRRPuCBrUA@mail.gmail.com>]
* Re: Request update of TCL and expect packages [not found] ` <CAM_o6DVj7UAuit0FNqMhQLe1=GU2ft_cphmcmBQ+PRRPuCBrUA@mail.gmail.com> @ 2011-10-28 19:32 ` Craig Miller 0 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Craig Miller @ 2011-10-28 19:32 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Charles Wilson, cygwin On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 2:44 PM, Craig Miller <cvmiller@gmail.com> wrote: > On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 4:11 PM, Charles Wilson > <> wrote: >> On 10/27/2011 2:40 PM, Craig Miller wrote: >>> Thank you for the additional information, Marco. >>> >>> If it is of any assistance to Christopher Faylor, I believe the >>> tcl/expect and dependent packages have been upgraded on sourceware >>> <ftp://sourceware.org/pub/cygwinports/portslist.txt>, perhaps the >>> upgrade will not be that time consuming. >> >> ATTENTION: Tcl/Tk transition >> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin-apps/2011-10/msg00083.html >> >> -- >> Chuck >> >> Thanks Chuck for the detailed analysis. I look forward to Yaakov's versions in the main cygwin distro. Craig... -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2011-10-28 19:32 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 10+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
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2011-10-25 17:37 Request update of TCL and expect packages Craig Miller
2011-10-26 16:50 ` Chris Sutcliffe
2011-10-26 20:27 ` Marco Atzeri
2011-10-27 18:30 ` Dave
2011-10-27 18:43 ` Craig Miller
2011-10-27 20:07 ` Charles Wilson
2011-10-27 20:09 ` Charles Wilson
2011-10-27 18:40 ` Craig Miller
2011-10-27 20:11 ` Charles Wilson
[not found] ` <CAM_o6DVj7UAuit0FNqMhQLe1=GU2ft_cphmcmBQ+PRRPuCBrUA@mail.gmail.com>
2011-10-28 19:32 ` Craig Miller
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