public inbox for cygwin@cygwin.com
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Lam Pui Yuen <yuen@hknet.com>
To: Fergus Henderson <fjh@cs.mu.OZ.AU>
Cc: Christopher Faylor <cgf@cygnus.com>, cygwin@sourceware.cygnus.com
Subject: Re: Cygwin participation threshold
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 01:00:00 -0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.BSI.3.95.990225170005.16688A-100000@topaz.hknet.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: < 19990225191420.16813@mundook.cs.mu.OZ.AU >

done !

On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Fergus Henderson wrote:

> On 24-Feb-1999, Christopher Faylor <cgf@cygnus.com> wrote:
> > On Thu, Feb 25, 1999, Fergus Henderson wrote:
> > >Yes, but you can write and distribute proprietry applications or even
> > >proprietry kernel modules for Linux without paying anyone a license fee.
> > >The same is not true for Cygwin (although it *was* true once, back around
> > >version b16, when it was called gnu-win32).
> > 
> > True, but that is not the point.  I believe this whold thread started
> > because I lamented the lack of people contributing directly to cygwin
> > development.
> 
> You also asked why.  I believe that licensing may be one of the reasons why.
> So I don't think my comment is beside the point.  You may disagree with me,
> but I think we're talking about the same topic.
> 
> > The many contributors to the linux kernel do not do so
> > because it is possible to develop proprietary code for linux.
> 
> That may not be their direct motivation, but I do think it is a
> significant factor.  I think that if it were impossible to develop
> proprietry code for Linux, then Linux would have a much smaller user
> base, and there would be far fewer contributors to Linux.
> 
> > I don't consider companies who create proprietary kernel modules as
> > contributing to linux development in any way.
> 
> The ability to create proprietry kernel modules is of little importance.
> The ability to create proprietry applications is of much greater importance.
> 
> > Possibly they help indirectly
> > by getting the word out about linux but that is a secondary and, IMO, very
> > minor benefit.
> 
> I agree that the benefits are indirect and secondary.  However,
> I don't think they should be ignored.
> 
> In addition to getting the word out, companies which develop proprietry
> applications (or kernel modules) often also help
> 
> 	(1) by using Linux, and in the process sometimes reporting
> 	    and/or fixing bugs in the kernel and/or the various
> 	    open-source applications that are part of Linux; sometimes
> 	    they will even add whole new features which are needed for
> 	    their proprietry application (or module); and
> 
> 	(2) by providing software (or drivers) which other people need,
> 	    and thus encouraging those other people to use Linux,
> 	    leading to the same benefits as (1).
> 
> -- 
> Fergus Henderson <fjh@cs.mu.oz.au>  |  "Binaries may die
> WWW: < http://www.cs.mu.oz.au/~fjh >  |   but source code lives forever"
> PGP: finger fjh@128.250.37.3        |     -- leaked Microsoft memo.
> 
> --
> Want to unsubscribe from this list?
> Send a message to cygwin-unsubscribe@sourceware.cygnus.com
> 
> 


--
Want to unsubscribe from this list?
Send a message to cygwin-unsubscribe@sourceware.cygnus.com

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID
From: Lam Pui Yuen <yuen@hknet.com>
To: Fergus Henderson <fjh@cs.mu.OZ.AU>
Cc: Christopher Faylor <cgf@cygnus.com>, cygwin@sourceware.cygnus.com
Subject: Re: Cygwin participation threshold
Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 23:02:00 -0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <Pine.BSI.3.95.990225170005.16688A-100000@topaz.hknet.com> (raw)
Message-ID: <19990228230200.EbbD8iilU3TdCco9DosQbuwZMe-0KJSwN23WvmCg9as@z> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <19990225191420.16813@mundook.cs.mu.OZ.AU>

done !

On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Fergus Henderson wrote:

> On 24-Feb-1999, Christopher Faylor <cgf@cygnus.com> wrote:
> > On Thu, Feb 25, 1999, Fergus Henderson wrote:
> > >Yes, but you can write and distribute proprietry applications or even
> > >proprietry kernel modules for Linux without paying anyone a license fee.
> > >The same is not true for Cygwin (although it *was* true once, back around
> > >version b16, when it was called gnu-win32).
> > 
> > True, but that is not the point.  I believe this whold thread started
> > because I lamented the lack of people contributing directly to cygwin
> > development.
> 
> You also asked why.  I believe that licensing may be one of the reasons why.
> So I don't think my comment is beside the point.  You may disagree with me,
> but I think we're talking about the same topic.
> 
> > The many contributors to the linux kernel do not do so
> > because it is possible to develop proprietary code for linux.
> 
> That may not be their direct motivation, but I do think it is a
> significant factor.  I think that if it were impossible to develop
> proprietry code for Linux, then Linux would have a much smaller user
> base, and there would be far fewer contributors to Linux.
> 
> > I don't consider companies who create proprietary kernel modules as
> > contributing to linux development in any way.
> 
> The ability to create proprietry kernel modules is of little importance.
> The ability to create proprietry applications is of much greater importance.
> 
> > Possibly they help indirectly
> > by getting the word out about linux but that is a secondary and, IMO, very
> > minor benefit.
> 
> I agree that the benefits are indirect and secondary.  However,
> I don't think they should be ignored.
> 
> In addition to getting the word out, companies which develop proprietry
> applications (or kernel modules) often also help
> 
> 	(1) by using Linux, and in the process sometimes reporting
> 	    and/or fixing bugs in the kernel and/or the various
> 	    open-source applications that are part of Linux; sometimes
> 	    they will even add whole new features which are needed for
> 	    their proprietry application (or module); and
> 
> 	(2) by providing software (or drivers) which other people need,
> 	    and thus encouraging those other people to use Linux,
> 	    leading to the same benefits as (1).
> 
> -- 
> Fergus Henderson <fjh@cs.mu.oz.au>  |  "Binaries may die
> WWW: < http://www.cs.mu.oz.au/~fjh >  |   but source code lives forever"
> PGP: finger fjh@128.250.37.3        |     -- leaked Microsoft memo.
> 
> --
> Want to unsubscribe from this list?
> Send a message to cygwin-unsubscribe@sourceware.cygnus.com
> 
> 


--
Want to unsubscribe from this list?
Send a message to cygwin-unsubscribe@sourceware.cygnus.com


  parent reply	other threads:[~1999-02-25  1:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 108+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
1999-02-16  7:41 Cygwin B20 - fseek under gcc fails to reposition on text files Earnie Boyd
     [not found] ` < 19990216154134.3413.rocketmail@send104.yahoomail.com >
1999-02-16 17:52   ` Christopher Faylor
     [not found]     ` < 19990216205243.L16511@cygnus.com >
1999-02-16 18:18       ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02         ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-17  2:01     ` Corinna Vinschen
     [not found]       ` < 36CA92B5.844635AA@cityweb.de >
1999-02-17  8:07         ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02           ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-17 13:46         ` J. J. Farrell
1999-02-28 23:02           ` J. J. Farrell
1999-02-17  9:36       ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
     [not found]         ` < 17817.990217@is.lg.ua >
1999-02-17 10:07           ` DJ Delorie
     [not found]             ` < 199902171807.NAA16764@envy.delorie.com >
1999-02-17 19:16               ` Larry Hall
     [not found]                 ` < 3.0.5.32.19990217221306.0162b070@pop.ma.ultranet.com >
1999-02-17 19:19                   ` DJ Delorie
     [not found]                     ` < 199902180318.WAA20394@envy.delorie.com >
1999-02-17 20:13                       ` Larry Hall
1999-02-28 23:02                         ` Larry Hall
1999-02-28 23:02                     ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02                 ` Larry Hall
1999-02-28 23:02             ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-17 13:37         ` Corinna Vinschen
1999-02-19  2:30           ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
     [not found]             ` < 17776.990218@is.lg.ua >
1999-02-19  6:36               ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-22  3:26                 ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
     [not found]                   ` < 13561.990222@is.lg.ua >
1999-02-22  8:55                     ` Cygwin participation threshold DJ Delorie
     [not found]                       ` < 199902221654.LAA07362@envy.delorie.com >
1999-02-22 10:33                         ` Carl Zmola
     [not found]                           ` < 19990222183222023.AAA254@carl_zmola >
1999-02-22 11:21                             ` Fergus Henderson
1999-02-28 23:02                               ` Fergus Henderson
1999-02-22 12:32                             ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02                               ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-24  0:08                             ` Christopher Faylor
     [not found]                               ` < 19990223214848.A23525@cygnus.com >
1999-02-24  5:51                                 ` Fergus Henderson
     [not found]                                   ` < 19990225005148.53402@mundook.cs.mu.OZ.AU >
1999-02-24  9:18                                     ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-24 19:23                                       ` Weiqi Gao
     [not found]                                         ` < 36D4C298.32C1C355@a.crl.com >
1999-02-25  0:23                                           ` Fergus Henderson
1999-02-25  6:01                                             ` Weiqi Gao
1999-02-25 13:48                                               ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
1999-02-28 23:02                                                 ` Paul Sokolovsky
1999-02-28 23:02                                               ` Weiqi Gao
1999-02-28 23:02                                             ` Fergus Henderson
1999-02-28 23:02                                         ` Weiqi Gao
     [not found]                                       ` < 19990224121846.A25762@cygnus.com >
1999-02-25  0:14                                         ` Fergus Henderson
     [not found]                                           ` < 19990225191420.16813@mundook.cs.mu.OZ.AU >
1999-02-25  1:00                                             ` Lam Pui Yuen [this message]
     [not found]                                               ` < Pine.BSI.3.95.990225170005.16688A-100000@topaz.hknet.com >
1999-02-25  1:09                                                 ` Lam Pui Yuen
1999-02-28 23:02                                                   ` Lam Pui Yuen
1999-02-28 23:02                                               ` Lam Pui Yuen
1999-02-28 23:02                                           ` Fergus Henderson
1999-02-28 23:02                                       ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02                                   ` Fergus Henderson
1999-02-24 10:37                                 ` Carl Zmola
     [not found]                                   ` < 19990224183738302.AAA218@carl_zmola >
1999-02-24 10:44                                     ` Christopher Faylor
     [not found]                                       ` < 19990224134450.B26262@cygnus.com >
1999-02-24 10:48                                         ` Carl Zmola
1999-02-28 23:02                                           ` Carl Zmola
1999-02-28 23:02                                       ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02                                   ` Carl Zmola
1999-02-28 23:02                               ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02                           ` Carl Zmola
1999-02-28 23:02                       ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02                   ` Re[2]: Cygwin B20 - fseek under gcc fails to reposition on text files Paul Sokolovsky
1999-02-28 23:02                 ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02             ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
1999-02-28 23:02           ` Corinna Vinschen
1999-02-28 23:02         ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
1999-02-28 23:02       ` Corinna Vinschen
1999-02-28 23:02     ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Earnie Boyd
1999-02-22  9:10 Cygwin participation threshold Suhaib M. Siddiqi
     [not found] ` < 008401be5e87$f1dcd510$29acdfd0@InspirePharm.Com >
1999-02-22 11:38   ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02     ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Suhaib M. Siddiqi
1999-02-22 13:00 Suhaib M. Siddiqi
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Suhaib M. Siddiqi
1999-02-22 20:54 Tom St Denis
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Tom St Denis
1999-02-24 10:55 Steve Morris
     [not found] ` < 199902241855.NAA16459@brocade.nexen.com >
1999-02-24 12:40   ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-24 13:13     ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
     [not found]       ` < 2965.990224@is.lg.ua >
1999-02-24 13:21         ` Christopher Faylor
     [not found]           ` < 19990224162212.A27405@cygnus.com >
1999-02-25 22:51             ` Geoffrey Noer
     [not found]               ` < 19990225225149.A1388@cygnus.com >
1999-02-26  7:26                 ` Larry Hall
1999-02-28 23:02                   ` Larry Hall
1999-02-28 23:02               ` Geoffrey Noer
1999-02-28 23:02           ` Christopher Faylor
     [not found]     ` < 19990224154034.E26668@cygnus.com >
1999-02-24 13:50       ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02         ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-26  8:27       ` Steve Morris
     [not found]         ` < 199902261627.LAA18993@brocade.nexen.com >
1999-02-27  7:49           ` Todd Goodman
1999-02-28 23:02             ` Todd Goodman
1999-02-28 23:02         ` Steve Morris
1999-02-26  8:55       ` Steve Morris
1999-02-28 23:02         ` Steve Morris
1999-02-28 23:02     ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-24 12:46 ` Re[2]: " Paul Sokolovsky
     [not found]   ` < 15947.990224@is.lg.ua >
1999-02-24 13:28     ` Christopher Faylor
     [not found]       ` < 19990224162911.A27461@cygnus.com >
1999-02-24 14:16         ` Mumit Khan
1999-02-28 23:02           ` Mumit Khan
1999-02-28 23:02       ` Christopher Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Steve Morris
1999-02-24 13:43 Ken Thompson
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Ken Thompson
1999-02-25 10:09 Bernard Dautrevaux
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Bernard Dautrevaux
1999-02-25 10:24 Suhaib M. Siddiqi
     [not found] ` < 004c01be60ee$09a84c20$29acdfd0@InspirePharm.Com >
1999-02-25 10:36   ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02     ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Suhaib M. Siddiqi
1999-02-26  0:26 Bernard Dautrevaux
     [not found] ` < 8135911A809AD211AF6300A02480D175034922@iis000.microdata.fr >
1999-02-26  8:40   ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02     ` DJ Delorie
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Bernard Dautrevaux
1999-02-28 16:22 Christopher G. Faylor
1999-02-28 23:02 ` Christopher G. Faylor

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=Pine.BSI.3.95.990225170005.16688A-100000@topaz.hknet.com \
    --to=yuen@hknet.com \
    --cc=cgf@cygnus.com \
    --cc=cygwin@sourceware.cygnus.com \
    --cc=fjh@cs.mu.OZ.AU \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for read-only IMAP folder(s) and NNTP newsgroup(s).