RE: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

RE: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Robert Collins]

http://cygwin.com/cvs.html

Rob

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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[George Hester]

Thanks Robert.  I went there.  But it looks as though I have to have Cygwin
installed to do this.  Let me give you an example:

On this page:

http://www.iol.ie/~locka/mozilla/plugin.htm

you will see an example how to get files using CVS.  That worked just fine
for me.

But on this page:

http://cygwin.com/cvs.html

the directions say this:

"Once you've done that, you need to tell your local cvs software what
password to use. The password is the word anoncvs :

bash$ cvs login."

As you can see there is a bash shell running.  Will I get into a bash shell
automatically upon connecting through CVS or do I need Cygwin installed
first?

--
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_________________________________
"Robert Collins" <robert.collins@itdomain.com.au> wrote in message
news:FC169E059D1A0442A04C40F86D9BA7600C5E9C@itdomain003.itdomain.net.au...
http://cygwin.com/cvs.html

Rob

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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)]

At 02:02 PM 4/20/2002, George Hester wrote:
>Thanks Robert.  I went there.  But it looks as though I have to have Cygwin
>installed to do this.  Let me give you an example:
>
>On this page:
>
>http://www.iol.ie/~locka/mozilla/plugin.htm
>
>you will see an example how to get files using CVS.  That worked just fine
>for me.
>
>But on this page:
>
>http://cygwin.com/cvs.html
>
>the directions say this:
>
>"Once you've done that, you need to tell your local cvs software what
>password to use. The password is the word anoncvs :
>
>bash$ cvs login."
>
>As you can see there is a bash shell running.  Will I get into a bash shell
>automatically upon connecting through CVS or do I need Cygwin installed
>first?


No.  This is simply an example using the cvs software that comes with 
Cygwin.  Use this as a guide to what you should do to login to Cygwin's
CVS using whatever local cvs software you have.  Don't take it literally.



Larry Hall                              lhall@rfk.com
RFK Partners, Inc.                      http://www.rfk.com
838 Washington Street                   (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
Holliston, MA 01746                     (508) 893-9889 - FAX


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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Randall R Schulz]

George,

What I see is that both pages instruct the user to do a "cvs login" and 
that's to be expected, since that part of CVS.

You don't need to use the Cygwin port of CVS to retrieve file from the 
cygwin.com CVS server. You can use a Windows native CVS command line or 
something like WinCVS or jCVS.

If you run a Cygwin CVS from a non-Cygwin shell (BASH, ash, tcsh), it will 
try to create and read the ".cvspass" file in the directory named by the 
value of the HOME environment variable, so if you try this, make sure that 
variable is set. I imagine that a Windows native port of the CVS 
command-line client will the do the same or something very similar. After 
all, Windows users have home directories, too. GUI CVS clients probably 
have their own configuration files or registry entries for storing this 
sort of information.

Otherwise, CVS is CVS. The interaction between the client and the server is 
specified by a protocol, and it doesn't matter which client or server you 
use, as long as they both properly implement that protocol.

It might help you to know that there is no "session" created by a CVS 
"login" command. That command simply prompts for and verifies the password 
with the server and then records it (if it's the command line CVS, it does 
as as I mention above and puts a mildly obscured version of the password 
into $HOME/.cvspass). Then each subsequent command directed at the same CVS 
server uses the password that was recorded in the .cvspass file. The CVS 
command line tool does not start an interactive sub-shell. To my knowledge, 
the only time it launches other processes is to create an editor for 
composing check-in or update commentaries.

Good luck.

Randall Schulz
Mountain View, CA USA


At 11:02 2002-04-20, you wrote:
>Thanks Robert.  I went there.  But it looks as though I have to have Cygwin
>installed to do this.  Let me give you an example:
>
>On this page:
>
>http://www.iol.ie/~locka/mozilla/plugin.htm
>
>you will see an example how to get files using CVS.  That worked just fine 
>for me.
>
>But on this page:
>
>http://cygwin.com/cvs.html
>
>the directions say this:
>
>"Once you've done that, you need to tell your local cvs software what
>password to use. The password is the word anoncvs :
>
>bash$ cvs login."
>
>As you can see there is a bash shell running.  Will I get into a bash shell
>automatically upon connecting through CVS or do I need Cygwin installed
>first?
>
>--
>George Hester
>_________________________________
>"Robert Collins" <robert.collins@itdomain.com.au> wrote in message
>news:FC169E059D1A0442A04C40F86D9BA7600C5E9C@itdomain003.itdomain.net.au...
>http://cygwin.com/cvs.html
>
>Rob
>
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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Michael A Chase]

On Fri, 19 Apr 2002 05:12:59 -0400 george hester <hesterloli@hotmail.com> wrote:

> 18 months ago.
> 
> George Hester
> 
> ----Original Message Follows----
>  > Well my response to you is using it the way you say I should resulted
> in
>  > BSOD the last time I tried to follow as you suggest in Windows 2000
>  > Professional.  So not using it is no big deal.  Thanks for your help.
> 
> When was the last time you attempted to install Cygwin with setup.exe?
> There have been problems on occasion, but the current version should not 
> cause BSOD.

Please keep the discussion on the list.  I am not the sole source of all wisdom.

Setup.exe has been completely re-written since then.  Try it again.  If you
still have problems with setup.exe, there is help available on cygwin@cygwin.com.
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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[misi misi]

Hallo,
from where can the source of setup be downloaded?
CVS is no choice, because of a firewall.

Is there a possibility to start setup.exe in 
batchmodus, so cygwin could be installed an a lot
of machines remotly?

Regards



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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)]

At 07:36 AM 4/19/2002, misi misi wrote:
>Hallo,
>from where can the source of setup be downloaded?
>CVS is no choice, because of a firewall.


No, CVS is it.


>Is there a possibility to start setup.exe in 
>batchmodus, so cygwin could be installed an a lot
>of machines remotly?


I refer you to:

http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2002-04/msg01008.html


Larry Hall                              lhall@rfk.com
RFK Partners, Inc.                      http://www.rfk.com
838 Washington Street                   (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
Holliston, MA 01746                     (508) 893-9889 - FAX


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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[George Hester]

Could you give the CVS commands to get the source of the setup?  I am
thinking this is the only way I can do what this post is asking.  At least
that is my understanding.  Thanks.

--
George Hester
_________________________________
"Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com> wrote in message
news:4.3.1.2.20020419102448.02a23de0@pop.ma.ultranet.com...
> At 07:36 AM 4/19/2002, misi misi wrote:
> >Hallo,
> >from where can the source of setup be downloaded?
> >CVS is no choice, because of a firewall.
>
>
> No, CVS is it.
>
>
> >Is there a possibility to start setup.exe in
> >batchmodus, so cygwin could be installed an a lot
> >of machines remotly?
>
>
> I refer you to:
>
> http://cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2002-04/msg01008.html
>
>
> Larry Hall                              lhall@rfk.com
> RFK Partners, Inc.                      http://www.rfk.com
> 838 Washington Street                   (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
> Holliston, MA 01746                     (508) 893-9889 - FAX
>
>
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>





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Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[George Hester]

The last time I tried the installer I did not like the result.  So now I
have downloaded all the packages I need evne the docs.  But I see nothing
about how to install this manually; what environment variables I should set.
Nothing at all.  All I see is telling me to use the installer.  If I do not
want to do this does that mean I cannot install Cygwin in Windows 2000?
Thanks.

--
George Hester
_________________________________





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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)]

At 10:25 AM 4/18/2002, George Hester wrote:
>The last time I tried the installer I did not like the result.  So now I
>have downloaded all the packages I need evne the docs.  But I see nothing
>about how to install this manually; what environment variables I should set.
>Nothing at all.  All I see is telling me to use the installer.  If I do not
>want to do this does that mean I cannot install Cygwin in Windows 2000?
>Thanks.


OK.  I guess you just somehow missed this:

http://www.cygwin.com/download.html

That explains your options.  Installing by a method other that setup is 
not really supported by this list however.  BTW, there are no *required*
settings beyond unpacking the software.  But if you want any of the 
additions that setup gives you, that's another argument for just using 
setup.  Of course, the source for setup is available if you'd just prefer 
to look at it to find out what it does.  But you're right.  There is no
documentation that guides you through a manual install of Cygwin.  It's
assumed that if you don't use setup, you understand enough about what 
you're doing to just do it.  Either that or you're the adventurous type. ;-)
Really, there's really no *magic* to setup though...






Larry Hall                              lhall@rfk.com
RFK Partners, Inc.                      http://www.rfk.com
838 Washington Street                   (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
Holliston, MA 01746                     (508) 893-9889 - FAX


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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Michael A Chase]

From: "Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com>
To: "George Hester" <hesterloli@hotmail.com>; <cygwin@cygwin.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 18:09
Subject: Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000


> At 10:25 AM 4/18/2002, George Hester wrote:
> >The last time I tried the installer I did not like the result.  So now I
> >have downloaded all the packages I need evne the docs.  But I see nothing
> >about how to install this manually; what environment variables I should
set.
> >Nothing at all.  All I see is telling me to use the installer.  If I do
not
> >want to do this does that mean I cannot install Cygwin in Windows 2000?
> >Thanks.

What didn't you like?  It may have been fixed or you might not understand
the implications of some of your choices.

> OK.  I guess you just somehow missed this:
>
> http://www.cygwin.com/download.html
>
> That explains your options.  Installing by a method other that setup is
> not really supported by this list however.  BTW, there are no *required*
> settings beyond unpacking the software.  But if you want any of the
> additions that setup gives you, that's another argument for just using
> setup.  Of course, the source for setup is available if you'd just prefer
> to look at it to find out what it does.  But you're right.  There is no
> documentation that guides you through a manual install of Cygwin.  It's
> assumed that if you don't use setup, you understand enough about what
> you're doing to just do it.  Either that or you're the adventurous type.
;-)
> Really, there's really no *magic* to setup though...

There are some mount points that _must_ be created for Cygwin to work
reliable and many packages have postinstall scripts that should be run.
Setup.exe will take care of them for you.  Without it you are on your own.

I'm only mentioning these as a caution against what you seem to insist on
doing.  Don't expect any support if you go against all advice.
--
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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)]

At 09:45 PM 4/18/2002, Michael A Chase wrote:
>From: "Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com>
>To: "George Hester" <hesterloli@hotmail.com>; <cygwin@cygwin.com>
>Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 18:09
>Subject: Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000
>
>
> > At 10:25 AM 4/18/2002, George Hester wrote:
> > >The last time I tried the installer I did not like the result.  So now I
> > >have downloaded all the packages I need evne the docs.  But I see nothing
> > >about how to install this manually; what environment variables I should
>set.
> > >Nothing at all.  All I see is telling me to use the installer.  If I do
>not
> > >want to do this does that mean I cannot install Cygwin in Windows 2000?
> > >Thanks.
>
>What didn't you like?  It may have been fixed or you might not understand
>the implications of some of your choices.
>
> > OK.  I guess you just somehow missed this:
> >
> > http://www.cygwin.com/download.html
> >
> > That explains your options.  Installing by a method other that setup is
> > not really supported by this list however.  BTW, there are no *required*
> > settings beyond unpacking the software.  But if you want any of the
> > additions that setup gives you, that's another argument for just using
> > setup.  Of course, the source for setup is available if you'd just prefer
> > to look at it to find out what it does.  But you're right.  There is no
> > documentation that guides you through a manual install of Cygwin.  It's
> > assumed that if you don't use setup, you understand enough about what
> > you're doing to just do it.  Either that or you're the adventurous type.
>;-)
> > Really, there's really no *magic* to setup though...
>
>There are some mount points that _must_ be created for Cygwin to work
>reliable 


I quite disagree with this point.  If it were true, it would be impossible 
to move a Cygwin executable and the DLL to a machine without a Cygwin 
install and have it work.  This does work in the general case, though 
there are specific packages for which it won't without additional 
configuration (like the mount points you mentioned, mount type, environment
variable settings, etc).  But those are limited exceptions to the rule.


>and many packages have postinstall scripts that should be run.


Which can still be run manually if the user chooses.  Setup automates the 
running of these but there is still nothing magical about them.


>Setup.exe will take care of them for you.  Without it you are on your own.
>
>I'm only mentioning these as a caution against what you seem to insist on
>doing.  Don't expect any support if you go against all advice.


I fully agree with this.  The above comments I made are really nits since I
want to dispel the myth that setup does things that can't be done manually.
Anyone really interested in installing "manually" can always look at what
setup does and perform the same steps.  My impression is that people looking
to install "manually" are looking for a scriptable setup, of which there is
already a start (thanks Rob).  I'd recommend anyone who plans to put any time
into creating their own automated installation to seriously consider adding
to the capabilities of setup in this area.  You'll leverage allot of work,
make things easier for yourself and others, and gain something that is 
maintainable over time.

Just my $.02.


Larry Hall                              lhall@rfk.com
RFK Partners, Inc.                      http://www.rfk.com
838 Washington Street                   (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
Holliston, MA 01746                     (508) 893-9889 - FAX


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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Michael A Chase]

On Fri, 19 Apr 2002 10:23:56 -0400 "Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com> wrote:

> At 09:45 PM 4/18/2002, Michael A Chase wrote:
> >From: "Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com>
> >To: "George Hester" <hesterloli@hotmail.com>; <cygwin@cygwin.com>
> >Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 18:09
> >Subject: Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows
> 2000

> > > Really, there's really no *magic* to setup though...
> >
> >There are some mount points that _must_ be created for Cygwin to work
> >reliable 
> 
> 
> I quite disagree with this point.  If it were true, it would be
> impossible 
> to move a Cygwin executable and the DLL to a machine without a Cygwin 
> install and have it work.  This does work in the general case, though 
> there are specific packages for which it won't without additional 
> configuration (like the mount points you mentioned, mount type,
> environment
> variable settings, etc).  But those are limited exceptions to the rule.

Those limited exceptions generate a lot of "Cygwin is broke" messages like when
a version of setup failed to create the /usr/bin and /usr/lib mounts a
couple months ago.

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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)]

At 02:12 PM 4/19/2002, Michael A Chase wrote:
>On Fri, 19 Apr 2002 10:23:56 -0400 "Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com> wrote:
>
> > At 09:45 PM 4/18/2002, Michael A Chase wrote:
> > >From: "Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc)" <lhall@rfk.com>
> > >To: "George Hester" <hesterloli@hotmail.com>; <cygwin@cygwin.com>
> > >Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 18:09
> > >Subject: Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows
> > 2000
>
> > > > Really, there's really no *magic* to setup though...
> > >
> > >There are some mount points that _must_ be created for Cygwin to work
> > >reliable 
> > 
> > 
> > I quite disagree with this point.  If it were true, it would be
> > impossible 
> > to move a Cygwin executable and the DLL to a machine without a Cygwin 
> > install and have it work.  This does work in the general case, though 
> > there are specific packages for which it won't without additional 
> > configuration (like the mount points you mentioned, mount type,
> > environment
> > variable settings, etc).  But those are limited exceptions to the rule.
>
>Those limited exceptions generate a lot of "Cygwin is broke" messages like when
>a version of setup failed to create the /usr/bin and /usr/lib mounts a
>couple months ago.



Exactly.  Which is why manual installation processes are a "use at your own
risk" approach.  My point is, if you're so inclined, you *can* install 
Cygwin and any of it's packages manually, without setup.  Again, the only
reason I mention this is because there have been indications from folks on 
this list that there is something which setup does that can't be reproduced
by any other mechanism.  This is just plain false.  However, I am in no 
way encouraging people to use or generate an installation method other than
setup.  Certainly, if one does so, this list cannot entertain questions 
about installation problems based on such a procedure.  I hope this message
and my previous response to this thread clarifies the installation issue for
those of all interests.  I guess we'll see if that is indeed the case. ;-)



Larry Hall                              lhall@rfk.com
RFK Partners, Inc.                      http://www.rfk.com
838 Washington Street                   (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
Holliston, MA 01746                     (508) 893-9889 - FAX


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Re: Where is the manual to manually install cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Christopher Faylor]

On Thu, Apr 18, 2002 at 09:09:09PM -0400, Larry Hall (RFK Partners, Inc) wrote:
>At 10:25 AM 4/18/2002, George Hester wrote:
>>The last time I tried the installer I did not like the result.  So now
>>I have downloaded all the packages I need evne the docs.  But I see
>>nothing about how to install this manually; what environment variables
>>I should set.  Nothing at all.  All I see is telling me to use the
>>installer.  If I do not want to do this does that mean I cannot install
>>Cygwin in Windows 2000?  Thanks.
>
>OK.  I guess you just somehow missed this:
>
>http://www.cygwin.com/download.html

Coincidentally enough, I just updated this page today.  I got rid of the
mention of bootstrap.zip since it was out of date.  I also updated the
README in the cygwin download directory, removing some obsolete words
and pointing at the above URL if you want to avoid setup.exe.

The README isn't completely up-to-date now but it is a little better.  I
don't know how many people actually read this README.  Apparently not
very many or we would have had complaints about some of the obsolete
info.

cgf

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Re: Where is the manual to manually install Cygwin in Windiows 2000

[Randall R Schulz]

George,

I don't know what's not to like about Setup.exe (well, maybe URL-encoded 
mirror directory names), but you're really bucking the tide and going 
against the grain in trying to install without Setup.exe.

You'll also be told (if this message doesn't forestall it) that this list 
doesn't cater to problems with installation or problems originating in 
installation errors for people who don't use the standard installation 
procedure based on Setup.exe.

On the off chance that your poor experience was the result of an earlier, 
less capable or less fully debugged version of Setup.exe, why don't you 
tell us when you last used Setup.exe and why it did not live up to your 
expectations.

Randall Schulz
Mountain View, CA USA


At 07:25 2002-04-18, George Hester wrote:
>The last time I tried the installer I did not like the result.  So now I 
>have downloaded all the packages I need evne the docs.  But I see nothing 
>about how to install this manually; what environment variables I should 
>set. Nothing at all.  All I see is telling me to use the installer.  If I 
>do not want to do this does that mean I cannot install Cygwin in Windows 2000?
>
>Thanks.
>
>--
>George Hester


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