From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "David C. Mason" To: esr@thyrsus.com Cc: docbook-tools-discuss@sourceware.cygnus.com Subject: Re: I'm trying to set up docbook-tools... Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 06:36:00 -0000 Message-id: References: <200007041511.LAA15779@snark.thyrsus.com> <00070410352500.07357@ehome.inhouse> <873dlnjklb.fsf@nwalsh.com> <20000706131959.A25726@thyrsus.com> <20000706150802.A26225@thyrsus.com> X-SW-Source: 2000/msg00232.html "Eric S. Raymond" writes: > Oh, no. That wasn't my only problem by a long shot. I actually went > through three different attempts to get three different sets of tools > running -- Jade, OpenJade, and the DocBook tools. Not one of them had > adequate documentation for beginners, even technically sophisticated > beginners like me with considerable prior knowledge of SGML (I did a > lot of of extension work on SGML-Tools for the LDP). All three have > web pages that are remarkable for the amount of detail they convey > without actually saying anything useful. Then I still don't understand the problems you are having... or at least, I still haven't seen a detail of what you would like to see. I think the ' Practical Guide...' is a very good intro to the scripts and creating a DB document - its short, to the point, and includes, what I think, you need to get started. But again, I can't figure out except the mirror stuff, what is wrong...I'd like to help > Do you mean like the user's guide I once wrote for SGML-Tools to > address exactly this problem? :-) > > Sorry, David. You don't get to accuse *me* of carping without > contributing. I happen to be the person who made SGML-Tools 1.1 > usable for fast-turnaround book publishing, proved it by producing > "Linux Undercover" for Red Hat, and then documented what I did. But > don't take my word for any of that -- go ask Ed Bailey about it. You'd > probably find the story both entertaining and instructive. I had no idea you did the first SGML-Tools and I apologize, you are a single entity in that case. Otherwise, I find that most hackers ignore these tools altogether. My apologies. Still, my problem is this thread has been about the lack of documentation for DocBook - but I still don't understand what the problem you are having is. I feel there is quite a bit of documentation out there, and if I knew the problem I could point you to it... if not, I could write it (especially since I am going to do a DocBook talk at OLS, this info would help me). Otherwise complaining about one or two particular documents doesn't do any good. You have stated why you didn't like Norm's book, you stated you didn't like the installation section in the 'Practical Guide...' HOWTO... so what do you want? Need? Is it *really* helpful to point out flaws in those particular documents when there might be one that answers your question? Dave -- David Mason Red Hat Advanced Development Labs dcm@redhat.com (919)547-0012 x248 From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "David C. Mason" To: esr@thyrsus.com Cc: docbook-tools-discuss@sourceware.cygnus.com Subject: Re: I'm trying to set up docbook-tools... Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 13:55:00 -0000 Message-ID: References: <200007041511.LAA15779@snark.thyrsus.com> <00070410352500.07357@ehome.inhouse> <873dlnjklb.fsf@nwalsh.com> <20000706131959.A25726@thyrsus.com> <20000706150802.A26225@thyrsus.com> X-SW-Source: 2000-q3/msg00030.html Message-ID: <20000706135500.f7Wp6gSBKJI-xuUJyU6DlA8OyhANjwZ3Bx_pfXm0wMk@z> "Eric S. Raymond" writes: > Oh, no. That wasn't my only problem by a long shot. I actually went > through three different attempts to get three different sets of tools > running -- Jade, OpenJade, and the DocBook tools. Not one of them had > adequate documentation for beginners, even technically sophisticated > beginners like me with considerable prior knowledge of SGML (I did a > lot of of extension work on SGML-Tools for the LDP). All three have > web pages that are remarkable for the amount of detail they convey > without actually saying anything useful. Then I still don't understand the problems you are having... or at least, I still haven't seen a detail of what you would like to see. I think the ' Practical Guide...' is a very good intro to the scripts and creating a DB document - its short, to the point, and includes, what I think, you need to get started. But again, I can't figure out except the mirror stuff, what is wrong...I'd like to help > Do you mean like the user's guide I once wrote for SGML-Tools to > address exactly this problem? :-) > > Sorry, David. You don't get to accuse *me* of carping without > contributing. I happen to be the person who made SGML-Tools 1.1 > usable for fast-turnaround book publishing, proved it by producing > "Linux Undercover" for Red Hat, and then documented what I did. But > don't take my word for any of that -- go ask Ed Bailey about it. You'd > probably find the story both entertaining and instructive. I had no idea you did the first SGML-Tools and I apologize, you are a single entity in that case. Otherwise, I find that most hackers ignore these tools altogether. My apologies. Still, my problem is this thread has been about the lack of documentation for DocBook - but I still don't understand what the problem you are having is. I feel there is quite a bit of documentation out there, and if I knew the problem I could point you to it... if not, I could write it (especially since I am going to do a DocBook talk at OLS, this info would help me). Otherwise complaining about one or two particular documents doesn't do any good. You have stated why you didn't like Norm's book, you stated you didn't like the installation section in the 'Practical Guide...' HOWTO... so what do you want? Need? Is it *really* helpful to point out flaws in those particular documents when there might be one that answers your question? Dave -- David Mason Red Hat Advanced Development Labs dcm@redhat.com (919)547-0012 x248