[ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[Øyvind Harboe]

> Further details at:  http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html

Is it just me or does this page "smell" stale?



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Øyvind Harboe
Embedded software and hardware consulting services
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Re: [ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[Sergei Gavrikov]

On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 09:45:57PM +0200, Øyvind Harboe wrote:
> > Further details at:  http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html
> 
> Is it just me or does this page "smell" stale?

Stale?

lynx -dump -nolist http://ecos.sourceware.org | grep 2009
   May 10, 2009 Public Domain Curses port
   March 30, 2009 eCos 3.0 final release
   February 22, 2009 eCos 3.0 beta 1 release

lynx -dump -nolist http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html | grep 2009
   lwIP 3.0  2009-06-05 Simon Kallweit An import of the lwIP 3.0
   STM32 USB 2009-06-05 Chris Holgate  A USB device driver for the STM32

It seems for me it is a great run. It's pity, but, I found no 2009's on
the eCosForge.

Sergei

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Re: [ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[Øyvind Harboe]

On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 10:16 PM, Sergei
Gavrikov<sergei.gavrikov@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 09:45:57PM +0200, Øyvind Harboe wrote:
>> > Further details at:  http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html
>>
>> Is it just me or does this page "smell" stale?
>
> Stale?

I'm thinking that it would make sense to have older & new stuff on a
separate pages not to dilute the new stuff.


> It seems for me it is a great run. It's pity, but, I found no 2009's on
> the eCosForge.

See the svn repository for 2009 stuff. The web site was never used really.

eCosForge provides little but an svn repository. I was thinking that perhaps
switching to git thinking on eCos + using a page with listed projects would
be neat. That would effectively render eCosForge obsolete.

eCos even has a fundamental concept about separate repositories, so
git like thinking would be a really neat match.

(Actual tool used, svn, git, mercurial, cvs, dracs, etc. doesn't matter as much
as pushing the concept of independent repositories.)



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Øyvind Harboe
Embedded software and hardware consulting services
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[ECOS] Re: eCos contributions and development projects

[John Dallaway]

Hi Øyvind

On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 09:45:57PM +0200, Øyvind Harboe wrote:
> 
>> Further details at:  http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html
> 
> Is it just me or does this page "smell" stale?

[ snip ]

> I'm thinking that it would make sense to have older & new stuff on a
> separate pages not to dilute the new stuff.

I was thinking exactly the same while I was editing the page earlier
today. We should continue to recognise contributions from the past, but
the page is now too long. There are also a number of contributions
missing from the list. I will look at splitting the content into
separate pages.

John Dallaway

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Re: [ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[Sergei Gavrikov]

On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 10:38:32PM +0200, Øyvind Harboe wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 10:16 PM, Sergei
> Gavrikov<sergei.gavrikov@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 09:45:57PM +0200, Øyvind Harboe wrote:
> >> > Further details at:  http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html
> >>
> >> Is it just me or does this page "smell" stale?
> >
> > Stale?
> 
> I'm thinking that it would make sense to have older & new stuff on a
> separate pages not to dilute the new stuff.
 
May be it has a sense, though eCos freshmeat is placed on the top and
the very interesting information about other contributions is placed
the very deeply the below :-)

> > It seems for me it is a great run. It's pity, but, I found no 2009's on
> > the eCosForge.
> 
> See the svn repository for 2009 stuff. The web site was never used really.

<OT>

Especially what the eCos community needs is good eCos wiki.  It's pity
that community has higly qualificated and talented developers (which
usual are the very busy to be the "teachers"), but has not the freelance
tech-writes, so, eCos wiki is just a dream for the most newcomers. The
main goal of the eCos wiki would be Don't give them (newcomers) a fish,
teach them how to fish. Unfortunately, the eCos newcomers get the fish
on the list. Why this off-topic? The front page of the eCosForge has
pmwiki engine, but, it's pity what it is almost empty. When you did
stand up eCosForge, I thought: Great! The wiki is placed on the front
page!  But... The eCos's "gold" hides itself inside the eCos CVS, and
eCosForge's "gold" hides itself in another VCS :-(

</OT>

So, I very liked the John's initiative of the eCos contributions
concept. It points the surfers on the latest eCos's gold.

> eCosForge provides little but an svn repository. I was thinking that
> perhaps switching to git thinking on eCos + using a page with listed
> projects would be neat. That would effectively render eCosForge
> obsolete.
> 
> eCos even has a fundamental concept about separate repositories, so
> git like thinking would be a really neat match.
> 
> (Actual tool used, svn, git, mercurial, cvs, dracs, etc. doesn't
> matter as much as pushing the concept of independent repositories.)

As discussed in a past here, any distributed VCS has a lot advantages,
especially if an offered service gives the followers wiki (=web). I
liked bitbucket service. They offer HG with a support HG's patch queues.
BB's wiki is based on the Creole 1.0 mark-down specification and it's
Pygments library with the syntax lexers is just really cool thing, there
is an example how the CDL snippets can look
http://bitbucket.org/tickling/olpce2294b/wiki/Home

Regards

Sergei

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Re: [ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[Andrew Lunn]

> Especially what the eCos community needs is good eCos wiki.  It's pity
> that community has higly qualificated and talented developers (which
> usual are the very busy to be the "teachers"), but has not the freelance
> tech-writes, so, eCos wiki is just a dream for the most newcomers. The
> main goal of the eCos wiki would be Don't give them (newcomers) a fish,
> teach them how to fish.

When appropriate, i try to do that. However, it is not easy. We got a
lot of newbies to programming who try to use eCos. They don't have the
necessary background or experience and are going to struggle/fail. For
such people, giving them a fish means they are quiet for a while and
so you don't have to deal with them. Then there are the more
intelligent newcomers who do have some background, but not in
eCos. Such users i'm more likely to give them a bent pin, a long
stick, some string and point them towards the river.

Often the hard bit is figuring out from minimal information if they
have the capability to learn to fish.

       Andrew

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Re: [ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[Sergei Gavrikov]

Andrew Lunn wrote:
> > Especially what the eCos community needs is good eCos wiki.  It's pity
> > that community has higly qualificated and talented developers (which
> > usual are the very busy to be the "teachers"), but has not the freelance
> > tech-writes, so, eCos wiki is just a dream for the most newcomers. The
> > main goal of the eCos wiki would be Don't give them (newcomers) a fish,
> > teach them how to fish.
> 
> When appropriate, i try to do that. However, it is not easy. We got a
> lot of newbies to programming who try to use eCos. They don't have the
> necessary background or experience and are going to struggle/fail. For
> such people, giving them a fish means they are quiet for a while and
> so you don't have to deal with them. Then there are the more
> intelligent newcomers who do have some background, but not in
> eCos. Such users i'm more likely to give them a bent pin, a long
> stick, some string and point them towards the river.
> 
> Often the hard bit is figuring out from minimal information if they
> have the capability to learn to fish.
> 
>        Andrew

Andrew, well said. Two points. It seemed for me that newcomers would see
what eCos is the some specific river (lake?) there (on the wiki pages).
And they would decide for themselves before to bomb the list: Am I a
fisher? Can I become the eCos fisher? Will I can fish here at all?  

And the second. There are a lot of a bulrush is growing by the eCos
riversides, for example, How to configure this eCos (RedBoot) thing to
make a boat move by the river. How to ..., etc., etc., etc. So, it
seemed for me that it would be great to find the short explanations, the
CDL snippets, the configure tips and tricks on the eCos wiki pages,
well, in such a eCos Fisher's Club :-)

Sorry, and third. Of course, some fishers don't want to see on the
riversides loud fishers. And, perhaps, that's right, well, it is a
fishing. But, you know that the most of the newcomers come from M$ world
and if they came, why do not teach them new paradigm via wiki pages?
Should he/she wastes a time to manage any issue during days trying to
manage minicom, GDB, make fs image, etc. and bomb the list?  Why do not
read about on the wiki pages? What is eCos project then?  Is it a quite
lake or is it a live river? So, they come to the riverside, get the fish
from you and they do not know what to do with the given fish then, then
they won't be back. I do not know now, perhaps, it should be so.

Sergei



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[ECOS] eCos contributions and development projects

[John Dallaway]

eCos community

Following recent discussion concerning the NAND Flash infrastructure
contributions, the eCos maintainers are introducing a simple process by
which open development projects may be registered with us at an early
stage and listed on the eCos website.

In future, contributions arising from registered projects will be
considered for acceptance into the eCos repository with priority over
broadly equivalent contributions developed in private. This policy is
intended to encourage collaboration on new features and reduce the
possibility of a community development being rejected in favour of a
private development of similar scope and quality.

If you are involved in an eCos-related development which you are
intending to contribute, please do consider registering your project
with us.

Further details at:  http://ecos.sourceware.org/contrib.html

For avoidance of doubt:

a) Contributions from projects which are unable to register for
commercial or contractual reasons are still very welcome.

b) All contributions remain subject to technical review by the eCos
maintainers prior to acceptance into the eCos repository.

John Dallaway
On behalf of the eCos maintainers

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