From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wr1-x42a.google.com (mail-wr1-x42a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::42a]) by sourceware.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 53EB13840139 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 2022 08:10:30 +0000 (GMT) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.4.1 sourceware.org 53EB13840139 Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=gmail.com Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=gmail.com Received: by mail-wr1-x42a.google.com with SMTP id o5so14770996wrm.1 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 2022 00:10:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=F5rFAsUdrkJ+OVKHr9bnYiuo7EQr5eDlC2trD47w/Ro=; b=ZmDnBjlp4jE32bCXKUu4QNooBL4SAtjkgqYZqr/46iw5RELEU4koG0CdAwS42v6qih zl4N8WVs1tI79bZdFL1MAvJ6+1QReM9z6k+C/PJQ6jHPL0ML+lHhoNurtHnrML/ZQPXi jp8aM/MxbZFKNBaiAhjTkwkWgbFVYjWBPx494C4j6ZUF+QFMcHMdPImQMl0wfdxg4m/N d/ZWj4rK3DwvEQnxVaaNYuQnxpJ+w5jl6YHOmfVEnFckdAg43PHT9WNa8QgBDGYzFIcJ IMhkun40igUJpreKcJtvjRuBnW4b7dMcwSzb2e68ng8jXtI6P1kDMY88OhJqAFM4rtWB 7dtA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=F5rFAsUdrkJ+OVKHr9bnYiuo7EQr5eDlC2trD47w/Ro=; b=OsjolNM2hBqFq3mHmMRgJjFlNhf/USGIbkD682zYkr737PstKsKl1TfR+wiCsaaFLM s+5qdmFcuAd60ZE475OMyAT8eMWTY6IVzw2/F8AOoFjcYn4nX7BC+h3+q3LGJM81wjOE hGjuiUuUZnjwldnc8zOLEKFVdHhydF/A+CTP7AW145zEXEY32gG4ZF6cZw570wGpE0Ax 8lIFCquhoo2UHFXXKdaHDFwktBllGKVswphGzIGIDJXH/ZrAYEx57kkzs2EM2/diCs2x BAJ1dCWF0OlvN4s5nGJlaZehMf216eXjwjpLH6laDY55PGFnQiHLJSrIPdkOVwxkbXQV M9aQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ANoB5pmgGYox7CuACpL+e7vZGYbK2aylKFkI/Az46xXBwNHUYoQWiqDr CfsOmvUfvsPEFGeciaiZTWenSRHv7+H9zHH97XE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA0mqf4j4rfzMIR2ls/V8PCWSz4zseMDlxUsIy7v4bj1OToNBPzYqdTnOzm0jTlXm8f9vSUQY9xEmqvyTbqWG7wnp2Q= X-Received: by 2002:adf:ec83:0:b0:242:580f:3eb4 with SMTP id z3-20020adfec83000000b00242580f3eb4mr13587036wrn.450.1670919028883; Tue, 13 Dec 2022 00:10:28 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <6e48ab2c-f006-c57f-db39-2b3efb6b30a4@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <6e48ab2c-f006-c57f-db39-2b3efb6b30a4@gmail.com> From: Janne Blomqvist Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2022 10:10:17 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Team Collaboration Considerations To: Jerry D Cc: gfortran Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,FREEMAIL_FROM,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,TXREP autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.6 (2021-04-09) on server2.sourceware.org List-Id: On Sun, Dec 4, 2022 at 5:53 AM Jerry D via Fortran wrote: > 1. Slack has adopted some limitations on being able to go back and look > at older posts. Functionally it is quite good and integrates well > with github. > 2. I looked at Element and Fractal which use the Matrix protocols. > Very open source, not so mature yet. > 3. Mattermost looks pretty good and was easy to set up. The free > version is a bit better than Slacks. GCC C++ uses it. > > If we can get a concensus I would happy to get something set up . I am > leaning to Mattermost. The mobile phone app is easy and the web browser > works fine. > > I do think in the long run, doing this will help everyone greatly. > > Any thoughts from all? Hi, I haven't commented earlier as I haven't been active in GFortran development for a couple of years (new job, kids, etc. etc.). So don't take my opinions too seriously. But in general, yes, I do think IRC is showing its age in an increasingly multi-device and mobile world. From a Free Software perspective, adopting a closed platform like Slack is perhaps not ideal, if alternatives exist. And I believe the free (as in beer) version of Slack has some significant limitations compared to the licensed one. Matrix is perhaps the one with the most future potential, but maybe it's not really there yet. While I haven't used Mattermost myself, I've heard good things about it. And as long as it's not used as some sort of permanent record of things instead of the mailing list, I guess it's relatively easy to switch to another platform in the future. Just to be sure, this is some hosted version, and not something which Jerry must maintain himself on some server in a dusty corner? As for the perennial question of how to attract new contributors, yeah, it's hard. I'm happy to see that Harald has gotten off to a flying start, amazing! I also do note with some satisfaction that there's some good efforts to make modern Fortran attractive for developers, and not just something you use because the codebase you work on was started 4 decades ago. Gtk-Fortran was an early example of this which showed that modern Fortran could be useful outside the core numerics domain. I'm also thinking of the https://fortran-lang.org site and associated efforts like the 'stdlib', a more fleshed out 'standard' library (https://stdlib.fortran-lang.org/ ), and the package manager FPM (https://fpm.fortran-lang.org ). Keeping in touch with these people, and suggesting that people help that effort if they aren't comfortable with hacking on the compiler outright, could be a way of growing the open source Fortran programmer base, which could eventually grow into contributors to the compiler itself? In particular if they want to use some newfangled Fortran feature that doesn't work in GFortran; scratching your own itch is always a good motivator! -- Janne Blomqvist