your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Klaus Berger]

hello,

please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other shit.
either you fucking hell release that damn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
people.

-- 
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Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Email.com
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Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Andreas Jaeger]

"Klaus Berger" <klausberger@email.com> writes:

> hello,
>
> please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
> all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
> a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
> released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
> doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
> are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other shit.
> either you fucking hell release that damn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
> for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
> is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
> over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
> people.

If you would have followed the mails a bit better, you would be aware
of the reasons why it took longer to release GCC 3.1: We fixed a
number of serious regression and it's more important to fix bugs
instead of beeing on time.  I fully support Mark Mitchell in these
decisions and like to say that he has not pissed of the people working
on GCC (at least not me ;-).

Btw. I do think that neither your tone nor your attitude are
appropriate - and your previous contribution in GCC does not allow you
to make such demands.  If you're so eager to work with GCC 3.1, you
could have used a prerelease and helped with testing and fixing the
bugs.

Andreas
-- 
 Andreas Jaeger
  SuSE Labs aj@suse.de
   private aj@arthur.inka.de
    http://www.suse.de/~aj

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Sven Lundblad]

Hi,

We are many how waits for gcc 3.1 but accurate predicting when a
software project has achieved its goal is hard and requires a lot of
planing work (and often fail any way). To be pissed on people that put a
lot of effort into gcc just because a release estimate is missed seams
very immature to me and I have a great admiration for the people making
this great compiler a reality.

Please keep up the great work and big thanks to all gcc contributors!

Regards,
Sven Lundblad

Klaus Berger wrote:
> 
> hello,
> 
> please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
> all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
> a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
> released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
> doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
> are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other shit.
> either you fucking hell release that damn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
> for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
> is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
> over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
> people.
> 
> --
> _______________________________________________
> Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Email.com
> http://www.email.com/?sr=signup

-- 
---
Sven Lundblad, OSE Systems

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Allan Sandfeld Jensen]

On Wednesday 15 May 2002 08:22, Klaus Berger wrote:
> hello,
>
> please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
> all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
> a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
> released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
> doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
> are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other shit.
> either you fucking hell release that damn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
> for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
> is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
> over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
> people.

You have a funny way of begging. But even if you really begged in your 
bleeding knees it wouldnt help, gcc 3.1 is released when it's ready. This is 
not a corporation where you release prematurely just for your boss not to 
lose face over some silly deadline.

Btw. iIf you really need a compiler why dont you use the prereleases or even 
gcc 2.95? They are both fine .


`Allan

PS. Why did I reply to this troll?

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Nathan Sidwell]

Allan Sandfeld Jensen wrote:

> You have a funny way of begging. But even if you really begged in your
> bleeding knees it wouldnt help, gcc 3.1 is released when it's ready. This is
> not a corporation where you release prematurely just for your boss not to
> lose face over some silly deadline.
Like the beer commercial (in .uk at any rate),
<accent=dutch>
  what are you doing? This software is not ready yet. 
  GNU. We only let you use it when it's ready.
</accent>

nathan

-- 
Dr Nathan Sidwell :: Computer Science Department :: Bristol University
           The voices in my head told me to say this
nathan@acm.org  http://www.cs.bris.ac.uk/~nathan/  nathan@cs.bris.ac.uk

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Kris Warkentin]

You know what?  Someone walks up to me, hands me some nice, free stuff and I
slap them and say, "You said you were going to give it to me yesterday."
Makes me a bit of a prick doesn't it?  Makes you a prick too.  You want to
yell at people about software release dates?  Don't be a cheap fucker
because there's lots of compiler vendors who will be happy to take your
money and will listen to your complaints, ($50 per incident).  You want
service?  Pay for it.  You want good quality free software?  It will be
ready when it's ready.

Kris

----- Original Message -----
From: "Klaus Berger" <klausberger@email.com>
To: <gcc@gnu.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 2:22 AM
Subject: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke


> hello,
>
> please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
> all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
> a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
> released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
> doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
> are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other shit.
> either you fucking hell release that damn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
> for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
> is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
> over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
> people.
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Email.com
> http://www.email.com/?sr=signup
>
>

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Kris Warkentin]

Hey, my email got bounced.  He can swear at us but we can't swear at him.
;-)

Trend SMEX Content Filter has detected sensitive content.

Place = Klaus Berger; gcc@gnu.org; ;
Sender = Kris Warkentin
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Kris Warkentin" <kewarken@qnx.com>
To: "Klaus Berger" <klausberger@email.com>; <gcc@gnu.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 7:40 AM
Subject: Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke


> You know what?  Someone walks up to me, hands me some nice, free stuff and
I
> slap them and say, "You said you were going to give it to me yesterday."
> Makes me a bit of a prick doesn't it?  Makes you a prick too.  You want to
> yell at people about software release dates?  Don't be a cheap fscker
> because there's lots of compiler vendors who will be happy to take your
> money and will listen to your complaints, ($50 per incident).  You want
> service?  Pay for it.  You want good quality free software?  It will be
> ready when it's ready.
>
> Kris
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Klaus Berger" <klausberger@email.com>
> To: <gcc@gnu.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 2:22 AM
> Subject: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke
>
>
> > hello,
> >
> > please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
> > all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
> > a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
> > released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
> > doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
> > are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other s**t.
> > either you fscking he11 release that darn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
> > for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
> > is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
> > over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
> > people.
> >
> > --
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Email.com
> > http://www.email.com/?sr=signup
> >
> >
>
>

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Marc Espie]

Compared to past slippages, I would say that the gcc 3.1 schedule
is a vast improvement indeed !

Kuddos to everyone, hoping it will be even better in the future.

RE: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Chip Cuntz]

As a casual user of your awesome product slips don't bother the least bit.
Maybe someday I'll make the leap from regular reader of this list and join
the elite coders who work on the GNU compiler.  Thanks for the effort and
screw Klaus Berger.  What planet is this person from any how?

Chip

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[mike stump]

> From: "Klaus Berger" <klausberger@email.com>
> To: gcc@gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 01:22:04 -0500

> please allow me to write exactly this lines to you. i know you are
> all doing a nice job on gcc 3.1 but i feel fooled by your gcc maintainer
> a lot of date shifts 14th april to 1st may then it was said to be
> released in the next days, last weekend mark mitchell said that he is
> doing the packages after weekend and now we have wednesday. either you
> are fooling us or you are doing this to get time to fix other shit.
> either you fucking hell release that damn gcc 3.1 that i am waiting
> for - for over a month now that i really like to have or if the work
> is to hard for you (like life of a maintainer beeing hard) then hand
> over the work to someone else who is capable to NOT pissoff their
> people.

And this is why the previous policy was the way it was, to avoid the
above type of situation.  It was generally felt that the user didn't
need the aggravation and we didn't need the pressure.  Remember, for
each one of them, there are 20 that have not spoken up.

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[mike stump]

> To: "Klaus Berger" <klausberger@email.com>
> Cc: gcc@gnu.org
> From: Andreas Jaeger <aj@suse.de>
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 09:00:12 +0200

> If you would have followed the mails a bit better,

Please don't whack the user.  It wasn't his fault, and it is natural
for him to expect it, because _we set his expectation_.

> Btw. I do think that neither your tone nor your attitude are
> appropriate - and your previous contribution in GCC does not allow you
> to make such demands.

Please don't whack the user.  It is not his fault he expected it, it
is our fault.

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[DJ Delorie]

The GCC project is run entirely by volunteers.  If you are not
satisfied with the progress of any aspect of the project, feel free to
step in and help.  The GPL specifically allows you to "do it yourself"
if that isn't sufficient.  Otherwise, feel free to contract with an
existing volunteer to work in your best interests in exchange for a
fee.  There are no other obligations on the part of the GCC
development team - to you, to us, to a schedule - none.

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Joe Buck]

> > If you would have followed the mails a bit better,
> 
> Please don't whack the user.  It wasn't his fault, and it is natural
> for him to expect it, because _we set his expectation_.

The user is not being whacked because of his expectation (that gcc 3.1
would be out May 1).  He is being whacked, properly, for hurling vitriolic
abuse at people who are working as hard as they can for him, for free.

We no longer have a private development list, so it's not possible to
get developers working to get a release out on time without also telling
the users what date we are aiming for.  Given this situation, slips will
happen, and the alternative of simply not mentioning a date won't work
(since dates will have to be mentioned at least privately and they will
leak).

Mark, maybe next time you mention a tentative release date, more language
should be added warning people against incorporating the date in any of
their own plans, since schedule slips are not only possible but likely.

Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Adam Megacz]

"Kris Warkentin" <kewarken@qnx.com> writes:
> Hey, my email got bounced.  He can swear at us but we can't swear at
> him.

So what happens when he swears at himself?

  - a

-- 
The web is dead; long live the Internet.
http://www.xwt.org/

RE ignoranc: was Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke

[Bobby McNulty Junior]

He is obviously an ignorant person.
I am using a snapshop of 3.1.
It's doing all right.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Adam Megacz" <gcc@lists.megacz.com>
To: <gcc@gnu.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 5:16 PM
Subject: Re: your gcc 3.1 release date is a joke


> 
> "Kris Warkentin" <kewarken@qnx.com> writes:
> > Hey, my email got bounced.  He can swear at us but we can't swear at
> > him.
> 
> So what happens when he swears at himself?
> 
>   - a
> 
> -- 
> The web is dead; long live the Internet.
> http://www.xwt.org/
>