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From: dewar@gnat.com (Robert Dewar)
To: torvalds@transmeta.com, velco@fadata.bg
Cc: gcc@gcc.gnu.org, zack@codesourcery.com
Subject: Re: source mgt. requirements solicitation
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 17:33:00 -0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20021219004609.CBB78F28D5@nile.gnat.com> (raw)

> To paraphrase, programming is often 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration.
> 
> In short, your argument is elitist and simply _wrong_.  It's true that to
> create a whole compiler you need a whole lot of knowledge, but that's true
> of any project - including operating systems. But that doesn't matter,
> because there isn't "one" person who needs to know everything.

I must disagree here. In the case of compilers 1% inspiration and
99% perspiration is simply not enough. You need in addition a good
understanding of complex data structures and algorithms, as well as
a level of knowledge of the languages involved that goes far beyond
what most programmers have, as well as a knowledge of specific compiler
issues.

> Blaah. I _bet_ that is not true.

Remember just what (in your inimitable style :-) you are saying is not
true. You are saying that it is not necessary that working on a compiler
requires knowledge. I find that a pretty extreme (and definitely incorrect
viewpoint).

> I didn't understand the whole compiler, BUT THAT DID NOT MATTER. The same
> way that most Linux kernel developers don't understand the whole kernel,
> and do not even need to.  Sure, you need people with specialized knowledge
> for specialized areas (designing the big picture etc), but that's a small
> small part of it.

Sure there are parts of any code that can be attacked and modified using
a kind of pattern matching approach (well look here, this built in was
done that way, so presumably I can add another built in this way), but
I certainly hope you do not try to attack complex optimization circuits
this way.

If you tell me that working on the kernel requires no knowledge, fine, I
accept your extensive experience here, but I don't think you begin to have
the perspective to extend this judgment to the realm of compilers :-)

             reply	other threads:[~2002-12-19  0:46 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 67+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2002-12-18 17:33 Robert Dewar [this message]
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2002-12-18  9:58 Robert Dewar
2002-12-18  9:35 Robert Dewar
2002-12-18  9:22 Robert Dewar
2002-12-18  9:07 Robert Dewar
2002-12-18  9:48 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-18 10:11   ` Phil Edwards
2002-12-18  9:06 Robert Dewar
2002-12-15 18:29 Nathanael Nerode
2002-12-14 20:16 Nathanael Nerode
2002-12-14 21:34 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-12  6:43 Robert Dewar
2002-12-08  7:13 on reputation and lines and putting things places (Re: gcc branches?) Robert Dewar
2002-12-08 14:18 ` source mgt. requirements solicitation Tom Lord
2002-12-08 14:56   ` DJ Delorie
2002-12-08 15:02     ` David S. Miller
2002-12-08 15:45       ` Bruce Stephens
2002-12-08 16:52         ` David S. Miller
2002-12-08 15:11     ` Bruce Stephens
2002-12-08 16:24       ` Joseph S. Myers
2002-12-08 16:47         ` Tom Lord
2002-12-08 22:20           ` Craig Rodrigues
2002-12-08 16:09   ` Phil Edwards
2002-12-08 19:13     ` Zack Weinberg
2002-12-09 10:33       ` Phil Edwards
2002-12-09 11:06       ` Joseph S. Myers
2002-12-09  9:42         ` Zack Weinberg
2002-12-09 11:00           ` Jack Lloyd
2002-12-09 15:10     ` Walter Landry
2002-12-09 15:27       ` Joseph S. Myers
2002-12-09 17:05         ` Walter Landry
2002-12-09 17:10           ` Joseph S. Myers
2002-12-09 18:27             ` Walter Landry
2002-12-09 19:16               ` Joseph S. Myers
2002-12-10  0:27                 ` Zack Weinberg
2002-12-10  0:41                   ` Tom Lord
2002-12-10 12:05                   ` Phil Edwards
2002-12-10 19:44                   ` Mark Mielke
2002-12-10 19:57                     ` David S. Miller
2002-12-10 20:02                       ` Phil Edwards
2002-12-10 23:07                         ` David S. Miller
2002-12-11  6:31                           ` Phil Edwards
2002-12-14 13:43                   ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-14 14:06                     ` Tom Lord
2002-12-14 17:44                       ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-14 19:45                         ` Tom Lord
2002-12-14 14:41                     ` Neil Booth
2002-12-14 15:47                       ` Zack Weinberg
2002-12-14 15:33                     ` Momchil Velikov
2002-12-14 16:06                       ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-15  3:59                         ` Momchil Velikov
2002-12-15  8:26                         ` Momchil Velikov
2002-12-15 12:02                           ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-15 14:16                             ` Momchil Velikov
2002-12-15 15:20                               ` Pop Sébastian
2002-12-15 16:09                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-15 16:49                                   ` Bruce Stephens
2002-12-15 16:59                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2002-12-15 18:10                                       ` Bruce Stephens
2002-12-16  8:32                                       ` Diego Novillo
2002-12-17  3:36                                         ` Pop Sébastian
2002-12-17 13:14                                           ` Tom Lord
2002-12-16 17:22                                   ` Mike Stump
2002-12-15 17:09                         ` Stan Shebs
2002-12-09 17:50           ` Zack Weinberg
2002-12-11  1:11         ` Branko Čibej
2002-12-08 18:32   ` Joseph S. Myers
2002-12-11  2:48     ` Branko Čibej

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