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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: Eric Gallager <egall@gwmail.gwu.edu>
Cc: jwakely.gcc@gmail.com, joel@rtems.org, dje.gcc@gmail.com,
	jakub@redhat.com, arsen@aarsen.me, gcc@gcc.gnu.org
Subject: Re: More C type errors by default for GCC 14
Date: Wed, 10 May 2023 15:00:53 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <83wn1g8kga.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAMfHzOsR=gY6QTss2R029Q-uMOTpC-RDV09bEF2FO7x5jpy5gg@mail.gmail.com> (message from Eric Gallager on Wed, 10 May 2023 06:40:54 -0400)

> From: Eric Gallager <egall@gwmail.gwu.edu>
> Date: Wed, 10 May 2023 06:40:54 -0400
> Cc: joel@rtems.org, David Edelsohn <dje.gcc@gmail.com>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, 
> 	Jakub Jelinek <jakub@redhat.com>, Arsen Arsenović <arsen@aarsen.me>, 
> 	"gcc@gcc.gnu.org" <gcc@gcc.gnu.org>
> 
> Idea for a compromise: What if, instead of flipping the switch on all
> 3 of these at once, we staggered them so that each one becomes a
> default in a separate release? i.e., something like:
> 
> - GCC 14: -Werror=implicit-function-declaration gets added to the defaults
> - GCC 15: -Werror=implicit-int gets added to the defaults
> - GCC 16: -Werror=int-conversion gets added to the defaults
> 
> That would give people more time to catch up on a particular warning,
> rather than overwhelming them with a whole bunch all at once. Just an
> idea.

What do we tell those who cannot possibly "catch up", for whatever
valid reasons?  E.g., consider a program written many years ago, which
is safety-critical, and where making any changes requires so many
validations and verifications that it is simply impractical, and will
never be done.  Why would we want to break such programs?

And that is just one example of perfectly valid reasons for not
wanting or not being able to make changes to pacify GCC.

Once again, my bother is not about "villains" who don't want to get
their act together, my bother is about cases such as the one above,
where the developers simply have no practical choice.

And please don't tell me they should use an older GCC, because as
systems go forward and are upgraded, older GCC will not work anymore.

  parent reply	other threads:[~2023-05-10 11:59 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 246+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-05-09 12:15 Florian Weimer
2023-05-09 14:16 ` Dave Blanchard
2023-05-09 15:03 ` David Edelsohn
2023-05-09 15:07   ` Sam James
2023-05-09 15:35     ` Dave Blanchard
2023-05-09 15:58       ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-09 16:26       ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-09 15:14   ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-09 15:22     ` Dave Blanchard
2023-05-09 16:38       ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-09 16:57         ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-09 17:05           ` Sam James
2023-05-09 18:55             ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-09 17:15           ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-09 19:04             ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-09 19:07               ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-09 19:22                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-09 20:13                   ` David Edelsohn
2023-05-09 20:21                     ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-10  2:38                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10  8:36                         ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-10 11:52                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 11:56                             ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 12:25                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 12:30                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 12:44                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-15 12:28                         ` Richard Earnshaw (lists)
2023-05-15 20:17                           ` Eric Gallager
2023-05-16  7:05                             ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-16 15:56                               ` Jason Merrill
2023-05-09 20:40                     ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-09 22:27                       ` David Edelsohn
2023-05-09 22:37                         ` Joel Sherrill
2023-05-09 22:45                           ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 10:40                             ` Eric Gallager
2023-05-10 10:45                               ` Sam James
2023-05-10 10:56                                 ` Neal Gompa
2023-05-10 12:06                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 12:10                                     ` Neal Gompa
2023-05-10 12:41                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 10:48                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 10:51                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 12:00                               ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
2023-05-10 12:42                                 ` Sam James
2023-05-10 15:10                             ` Joel Sherrill
2023-05-10 15:14                               ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-10 16:36                                 ` Joel Sherrill
2023-05-10 16:44                                   ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-10 17:05                                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 18:37                             ` James K. Lowden
2023-05-10 23:26                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-11 18:47                                 ` Jason Merrill
2023-05-10 23:33                               ` Sam James
2023-05-11  5:48                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11  2:28                             ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  2:09                       ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  2:14                         ` Sam James
2023-05-11  2:23                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  3:14                             ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-11  3:56                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  4:46                                 ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-11  4:49                                   ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-11  6:23                                     ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  6:18                                   ` Po Lu
2023-05-11 22:41                                     ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-12  2:08                                       ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  3:07                                         ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-12  5:57                                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-12 11:05                                             ` Gabriel Ravier
2023-05-12 13:53                                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-12 14:03                                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-14 12:35                                                 ` Mark Wielaard
2023-05-12 11:48                                             ` Is the GNUC dialect anything that GCC does when given source code containing UB? (Was: More C type errors by default for GCC 14) Eli Schwartz
2023-05-12 13:07                                               ` Is the GNUC dialect anything that GCC does when given source code containing UB? Po Lu
2023-05-12  6:56                                           ` More C type errors by default for GCC 14 Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12  7:28                                             ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-12 10:36                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12 13:19                                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-12 13:25                                                 ` Gabriel Ravier
2023-05-13  0:45                                                   ` Po Lu
2023-05-13  5:30                                                     ` Thomas Koenig
2023-05-13  5:53                                                       ` Po Lu
2023-05-14  5:10                                                         ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-14  5:38                                                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-14  9:46                                                             ` David Brown
2023-05-14 10:21                                                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-14 10:23                                                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-14  5:08                                                     ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-14  5:28                                                       ` Po Lu
2023-05-14  5:56                                                         ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-14 11:55                                                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-14 12:22                                                             ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-15  1:05                                                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-14  6:03                                                         ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-14  8:47                                                         ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-14 12:05                                                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-14 12:48                                                             ` Nicholas Vinson
2023-05-14 10:29                                                         ` David Brown
2023-05-12 15:51                                                 ` Jason Merrill
2023-05-17 10:06                                                   ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 11:26                                         ` David Brown
2023-05-11  6:24                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11 22:43                                     ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-12  2:38                                       ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  2:55                                         ` Jason Merrill
2023-05-12  6:01                                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  6:40                                             ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-12 13:23                                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-12 10:49                                             ` Pedro Alves
2023-05-12 13:26                                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-12 11:55                                             ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-12 13:54                                               ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  6:49                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12  2:56                                         ` Sam James
2023-05-12  6:03                                           ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  3:06                                         ` Sam James
2023-05-12  6:25                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12 11:23                                         ` Gabriel Ravier
2023-05-11  6:12                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11  7:04                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-11 22:30                                 ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-11 22:35                                   ` Sam James
2023-05-12  2:40                                     ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  2:52                                       ` Sam James
2023-05-12  5:32                                         ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  2:39                                   ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  3:18                                     ` Eli Schwartz
2023-05-12  6:17                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11  7:59                         ` David Brown
2023-05-09 21:00                     ` Thomas Koenig
2023-05-09 21:17                       ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-10 13:57                       ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-10 11:00                     ` David Brown
2023-05-11 10:49                       ` James K. Lowden
2023-05-11  1:38                     ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  1:43                       ` Sam James
2023-05-11  2:20                         ` Po Lu
2023-05-09 20:57                   ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-10  2:33                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10  8:04                       ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10  8:46                         ` Richard Biener
2023-05-10 12:26                           ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-10 11:30                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 12:03                           ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-10 12:36                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 12:41                               ` Gabriel Ravier
2023-05-10 14:14                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 14:22                                   ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-10 15:30                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 16:02                                       ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-10 16:31                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 16:33                                           ` Richard Biener
2023-05-10 16:57                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 17:08                                           ` Joseph Myers
2023-05-10 18:18                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12 15:02                                             ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 17:52                                               ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 17:55                                                 ` Gabriel Ravier
2023-05-12 18:00                                                   ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 18:08                                                   ` Alexander Monakov
2023-05-12 18:14                                                     ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-15 12:51                                                       ` Michael Matz
2023-05-16  8:55                                                         ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-16 10:39                                                           ` Alexander Monakov
2023-05-16 11:01                                                             ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-16 11:09                                                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-16 11:15                                                               ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 19:44                                               ` Joseph Myers
2023-05-12 20:43                                                 ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 20:18                                               ` Jason Merrill
2023-05-12 20:57                                                 ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 21:20                                                   ` Sam James
2023-05-12 21:21                                               ` Sam James
2023-05-12 21:37                                                 ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-12 21:47                                                   ` Sam James
2023-05-12 21:59                                                     ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-10 15:58                                   ` David Brown
2023-05-10 16:28                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11  6:52                                       ` David Brown
2023-05-11  7:39                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 14:31                             ` Thomas Koenig
2023-05-10 15:37                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11  2:38                         ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  7:38                           ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-11  8:31                             ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  8:44                               ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-11  9:28                                 ` Po Lu
2023-05-11 21:10                                   ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-12  1:41                                     ` Po Lu
2023-05-11 10:35                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-11 19:25                                   ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-12  2:36                                     ` Po Lu
2023-05-12 12:30                                       ` Gabriel Ravier
2023-05-12 13:56                                         ` Po Lu
2023-05-12  7:53                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12  8:15                                       ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-12 10:40                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-12  8:45                                       ` Christian Groessler
2023-05-12 10:14                                         ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-12  9:11                                       ` Thomas Koenig
2023-05-11  8:53                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-11  9:29                                 ` Po Lu
2023-05-10  8:49               ` David Brown
2023-05-10 11:37                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 11:49                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-10 12:22                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 13:30                       ` David Brown
2023-05-10 14:39                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 15:21                           ` Paul Koning
2023-05-10 16:20                           ` David Brown
2023-05-10 16:48                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 12:32                   ` Sam James
2023-05-10 12:47                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-09 19:33           ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-09 15:25     ` David Edelsohn
2023-05-11  1:25     ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  1:30       ` Sam James
2023-05-11  1:33       ` Sam James
2023-05-11  2:18         ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  6:44           ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-11  8:32             ` Po Lu
2023-05-11  8:52               ` Jonathan Wakely
2023-05-11  7:36       ` Arsen Arsenović
2023-05-11  8:23         ` Po Lu
2023-05-09 18:22   ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-11 21:32     ` Segher Boessenkool
2023-05-09 15:16 ` Richard Biener
2023-05-09 16:05   ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-09 16:11     ` Sam James
2023-05-09 16:13     ` David Edelsohn
     [not found]       ` <BBE9950C-28AA-4A1C-A4C5-7F486538004E@gmail.com>
2023-05-09 16:44         ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-09 16:58           ` Ian Lance Taylor
2023-05-09 17:08           ` Jason Merrill
2023-05-09 17:16             ` Sam James
2023-05-09 16:59   ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-09 17:07     ` Sam James
2023-05-09 17:35       ` Florian Weimer
2023-05-11 15:21 ` Peter0x44
2023-05-12  9:33 ` Martin Jambor
2023-05-12 12:30   ` Jakub Jelinek
2023-05-15 12:46     ` Michael Matz
2023-05-15 13:14     ` Richard Earnshaw (lists)
2023-05-10 12:41 Marcin Jaczewski
2023-05-10 14:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2023-05-10 13:10 Basile Starynkevitch
2023-05-10 14:20 ` David Brown

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