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From: Adrian <adrian.wilkins@gmail.com>
To: gcc@gcc.gnu.org
Subject: Re: removing toxic emailers
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2021 00:09:31 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAE34Az694pK7g28uN6paJdS0Me2Zf-LKHxzjiuedda_FO6dyJw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)

Eric S. Raymond <esr@thyrsus.com>:
> there is actually a value conflict between being "welcoming" in that
sense and the actual purpose of this list, which is to ship code.

Speaking as a "high functioning autist", I'm aware of the difficulties that
some of us have with social interactions - and also that many of us
construct a persona or multiple personae to interact with others, a
phenomenon known as "masking".

I understand why "Asshole" can function as a viable mask for many people,
because there are cultures where it's tolerated, particularly in
remote-working groups like mailing lists, where physical altercations are
unlikely and no-one has to confront the results of their interactions with
others if they don't want to.

It doesn't necessarily follow that "smart" == "asshole" though.

I disagree fundamentally that the assessment that the code contributions of
such people are necessarily more positive than those of the people they
drive away - *especially* people like me, another high-functioning autist,
because our difficulty with social interaction often includes a phenomenon
called RSD - Rejection Sensitivity Dysphoria - characterised by a
disproportionately overwhelming response to criticism amongst other things.

I've been coding for the better part of 4 decades and generally have
confidence in my ability, and still balk at participating in Free and OSS
projects where the lead members have an abrasive and confrontational style.
I learned to avoid these people (well, maybe the less smart people whose
mask they are copying) at school. Note - I'm not talking about constructive
criticism, I'm specifically talking about being unnecessarily unpleasant.

In contrast I still remember (and talk about) experiences contributing to
projects where the leads have been nothing but friendly and helpful.

It's not just about "the code alone" of one or a few talented "autist"
persons. These projects are intrinsically about community - that's baked
into the license. No-one really "codes alone". The code you never see
because people don't want to join in _could_ be just as great - but if
presenting as assholes has always been and always will be tolerated, maybe
you'll never see it.

Adrian Wilkins

             reply	other threads:[~2021-04-14 23:09 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 153+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-04-14 23:09 Adrian [this message]
2021-04-15  0:18 ` Soul Studios
2021-04-15 14:40 ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-15 22:49   ` Frosku
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2021-04-14 12:27 Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-14 13:18 ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-14 13:28   ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-14 13:38     ` Frosku
2021-04-14 13:45     ` Frosku
2021-04-14 14:49     ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-14 14:57       ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-14 15:10         ` Frosku
2021-04-14 15:08       ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-14 15:25       ` Didier Kryn
2021-04-14 17:09       ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 18:26         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 14:08   ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-14 15:06     ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-14 16:06     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 16:08     ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 20:39       ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-14 20:49         ` Christopher Jefferson
2021-04-14 20:49         ` Paul Koning
2021-04-14 21:38           ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-15  0:13             ` Paul Koning
2021-04-15  0:40               ` Chris Punches
2021-04-14 22:40           ` Frosku
2021-04-14 23:19             ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-14 23:28               ` Frosku
2021-04-14 23:36                 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-14 23:39                   ` Frosku
2021-04-15  0:03                     ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-22 22:04             ` Soul Studios
2021-04-15 14:00           ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-15 15:17             ` Iain Sandoe
2021-04-15 15:27               ` Paul Koning
2021-04-15 19:21                 ` Iain Sandoe
2021-04-15 19:45                   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 20:02                     ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-15 20:03                     ` Iain Sandoe
2021-04-15 20:58                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 21:24         ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 21:40           ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-14 21:57           ` Patrick McGehearty
2021-04-15  6:00             ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-15 16:18               ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-04-14 14:23   ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-14 14:54     ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-14 14:57       ` Frosku
2021-04-14 15:18       ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-14 15:21         ` Frosku
2021-04-14 15:21       ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-14 18:27         ` Joseph Myers
2021-04-14 20:02           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 13:49           ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-15 17:31             ` David Malcolm
2021-04-15 19:05               ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-15 19:27               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 20:26               ` Chris Punches
2021-04-15 20:51                 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-15 21:13                   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 23:11                   ` Frosku
2021-04-15 23:36                     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 23:44                       ` Frosku
2021-04-15 23:52                         ` Paul Koning
2021-04-15 23:55                           ` Frosku
2021-04-16  0:00                         ` Joseph Myers
2021-04-15 23:52                       ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-16  0:04                         ` Frosku
2021-04-16  0:16                           ` Joseph Myers
2021-04-16  0:41                             ` Frosku
2021-04-16  1:04                             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-16  0:48                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-17  9:09                     ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-17 11:56                       ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-17 14:41                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-17 18:11                         ` David Brown
2021-04-18  1:39                           ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-18 13:10                             ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-18 14:51                               ` David Malcolm
2021-04-18 15:59                                 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-18 18:24                                 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-18 19:13                                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-18 20:10                                     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-19  0:54                                     ` Frosku
2021-04-18 19:06                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-18 20:22                                   ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-19  1:10                                     ` Frosku
2021-04-19  2:42                                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-19  6:29                                       ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-19  6:31                                         ` Frosku
2021-04-19 15:06                                         ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-19 16:57                                           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-20  3:47                                           ` Frosku
2021-04-20  5:06                                             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-20  7:53                                             ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-20 14:03                                               ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-20 14:15                                                 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-20 14:22                                                   ` David Brown
2021-04-20 14:30                                                     ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-17 13:57                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 21:13                 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-15 23:21                   ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-04-15 22:09                 ` Christopher Jefferson
2021-04-15 22:40                 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-15 23:28               ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-16  0:20                 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-16  2:47                 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-16  3:02                   ` Frosku
2021-04-16  3:19                     ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-16  4:07                       ` Frosku
2021-04-16 16:28                         ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-16 23:15                           ` Frosku
2021-04-17  0:43                             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-17  4:05                             ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-17  4:08                               ` Frosku
2021-04-17  5:04                                 ` Andrew Pinski
2021-04-17  9:08                                   ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-17  9:41                                     ` Frosku
2021-04-17 15:07                                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-17  5:35                                 ` Jeff Law
     [not found]                                   ` <e324569ac358127174e1ba08337166c4d9494883.camel@silogroup.org>
2021-04-17  7:53                                     ` Frosku
2021-04-17  8:27                                       ` Aaron Gyes
2021-04-17  8:36                                         ` Frosku
2021-04-17  9:04                                           ` Aaron Gyes
2021-04-17  9:08                                             ` Aaron Gyes
2021-04-17  9:29                                               ` Frosku
2021-04-17  9:25                                             ` Frosku
2021-04-17 14:21                                               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-17 12:41                                         ` Liu Hao
2021-04-17 15:16                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-17  9:29                             ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-17  9:36                               ` Frosku
2021-04-16  8:54                       ` Iain Sandoe
2021-04-16 10:02                         ` Thomas Koenig
     [not found]                         ` <CAJWNc-7q+t1njvEow=a6QPD4uWA7htEZn=koRBNd3ziO4y8A-g@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                           ` <CAJWNc-6rDMvK12h8PcjrTZO5E-c4qNsh0SHQ0+kmGV71Jis67Q@mail.gmail.com>
2021-04-16 14:42                             ` Iain Sandoe
2021-04-16 15:14                               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-16 17:31                         ` NightStrike
2021-04-16  4:09                   ` Eric S. Raymond
2021-04-16  9:39                     ` Kalamatee
2021-04-16  9:58                       ` Frosku
2021-04-16 16:17                     ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-14 17:32   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 16:52 ` Martin Jambor
2021-04-14 18:19   ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-14 18:30     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 18:32     ` Paul Koning
2021-04-14 20:12       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15  0:10     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15  9:18       ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-15 14:25         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 10:20       ` Aaron Gyes
2021-04-15 14:31         ` Christopher Dimech

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