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From: David Edelsohn <dje.gcc@gmail.com>
To: Richard Biener <richard.guenther@gmail.com>
Cc: Mark Wielaard <mark@klomp.org>, GCC Development <gcc@gcc.gnu.org>,
	Nathan Sidwell <nathan@acm.org>
Subject: Re: Remove RMS from the GCC Steering Committee
Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 08:59:41 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAGWvnynARuKoyb6w8jVyM0yFFbcNJK2aiFxGRQoqWRzW+TDrDg@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAFiYyc22g3MHxyUWUr1bSEKRGnEZ5MKwHWD9_vVPHoMtmvEefg@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 8:28 AM Richard Biener via Gcc <gcc@gcc.gnu.org> wrote:
>
> On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 1:36 PM Mark Wielaard <mark@klomp.org> wrote:
> >
> > You are referencing the recent open letter which isn't really what
> > people are discussing here. Although many probably sympathize with
> > calling for the removal of the entire Board of the Free Software
> > Foundation and calling for Richard M. Stallman to be removed from all
> > leadership positions, including the GNU Project
> >
> > You can disagree with the specific way that was worded and still come
> > to the same conclusion. See for example https://www.arp242.net/rms.html
>
> Ah, this one is _very_ well written and captures my thoughts when
> writing my response to Nathan (but not willing to spend so much time
> on this to coherently formulate what I was thinking).
>
> And just to repeat - all the GCC governance structure (the "SC") represents
> all of the same non-openess as the FSF governance structure (because
> the "SC" is in fact appointed by the Chief GNUisance "or his delegates").

Richard historically has approved nominees to the GCC SC because the
GNU Project considers the SC the official "maintainers" of GCC, but he
has not nominated or suggested any of the members.  I don't remember
him rejecting a proposed nominee.  And many major contributors to GCC
have not wished to be members of the GCC SC whose major purpose is to
be a buffer between the GCC Community and the Free Software
Foundation.

Has the GCC SC micro-managed you or prevented you from doing anything
as Global Reviewer and Release Manager?  Not that I'm aware of.

Has the GCC SC blocked any new port or major feature?  Not that I'm aware of.

Has the GCC SC blocked any qualified maintainer nominations?  Not that
I'm aware of.

Has the GCC SC instructed GCC developers on which features to work?  No.

Has the GCC SC inserted itself or voted on any disagreements?  No.

The reality is that the governance of GCC is extremely open because
it's performed by the developers in the community, not the GCC SC.
And GCC is much less bureaucratic than other, large Open Source
projects.  It doesn't have multiple committees and SIGs.  Everything
is worked out among the developers.  Projects are started by
developers who take the initiative to start a project.

Be careful what you wish for because it may be much worse than the
freedom that you currently enjoy.

Thanks, David

  parent reply	other threads:[~2021-03-31 12:59 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 282+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2021-03-26 20:02 Nathan Sidwell
2021-03-26 20:20 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-26 20:51 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-26 21:18   ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-26 21:34   ` David Malcolm
2021-03-26 21:09 ` Marek Polacek
2021-03-26 22:53 ` Hi-Angel
2021-03-26 23:50   ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-03-27  7:08     ` Didier Kryn
2021-03-27 21:44       ` Andrea Corallo
2021-03-29 17:28       ` Christophe de Dinechin
2021-03-27 13:38 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-27 14:10   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-27 15:45     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-27 17:12   ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-03-27 17:33     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 14:50     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-28 17:25       ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-28 19:01       ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-03-28  2:16   ` Óscar Fuentes
2021-03-28  2:27     ` Óscar Fuentes
2021-03-28  4:08       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 12:47   ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-28 13:19     ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-28 14:33     ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-28 18:13       ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-28 18:42         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 19:15           ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30  0:20         ` Joseph Myers
2021-03-30  1:32           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30  8:20             ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30  2:08           ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-30 10:03             ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-28 17:58     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 18:24     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-28 23:21     ` Soul Studios
2021-03-29  0:20       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-29 12:18       ` Richard Kenner
2021-03-29 21:41         ` Soul Studios
2021-03-29 23:32           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30  0:09             ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-30  0:39               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30  1:30                 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-03-30  1:56                   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30  9:14               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-30 11:56               ` Richard Kenner
     [not found]             ` <20210330115515.E8A2033CB0@vlsi1.gnat.com>
2021-03-30 12:33               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30  9:28         ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-30 12:37           ` Richard Kenner
2021-03-27 20:49 ` Martin Liška
2021-03-27 22:10   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 17:48   ` Jeff Law
2021-03-27 22:07 ` Martin Jambor
2021-03-28 15:26 ` Jeff Law
2021-03-29 10:11 ` Richard Biener
2021-03-30  8:25   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30  9:47     ` Didier Kryn
2021-03-30  9:52       ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30  9:52       ` Didier Kryn
2021-03-30 10:12       ` Andrew Haley
2021-03-30 10:34         ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 11:12           ` Andrew Haley
2021-03-30 11:32             ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 10:50 ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-03-30 13:16 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-30 13:30   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 16:50   ` Martin Jambor
2021-03-30 17:10     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 18:30       ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-03-30 18:52         ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-30 16:56   ` Markus Böck
2021-03-30 17:07   ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-30 17:45     ` Joseph Myers
2021-03-30 18:13       ` Christopher Dimech
     [not found]         ` <CAFVAEf2CP87uEuca677MQt4hriQWk5Rn4s9AaQ0yGPUpAeXWpg@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]           ` <trinity-9f325315-c1b2-4fb5-b094-c0fd1534172a-1617140135769@3c-app-mailcom-bs07>
     [not found]             ` <CAFVAEf2QDDXMwAu1vtLpf-Gvqz6i19Jmph3dao9V6iWyysudMg@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]               ` <trinity-b0f59ed8-7545-49d0-979a-b6a5323107e5-1617146046177@3c-app-mailcom-bs07>
2021-03-30 23:56                 ` Andrew Sutton
2021-03-30 18:09     ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-30 21:28     ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-30 22:18       ` Joseph Myers
2021-03-31  8:53       ` Martin Jambor
2021-03-31 13:26         ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-31 11:34       ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-31 12:28         ` Richard Biener
2021-03-31 12:55           ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-31 12:59           ` David Edelsohn [this message]
2021-03-31 13:21             ` Richard Biener
2021-04-06 10:34               ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-31 13:46             ` Florian Weimer
2021-03-31 15:23               ` David Edelsohn
2021-03-31 15:43                 ` Richard Biener
2021-03-31 15:43           ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-31 12:46         ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-06 22:22           ` GCC association with the FSF Mark Wielaard
2021-04-06 22:28             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-07 14:04             ` David Malcolm
2021-04-07 17:17               ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-07 17:21                 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-08 15:00                 ` David Brown
2021-04-08 16:43                   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-08 18:40                     ` David Brown
2021-04-11 21:23                       ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 22:41                         ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-08 19:30                     ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-04-09 11:48                       ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-09 14:47                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 16:30                         ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-04-10 12:58                           ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-10 16:34                             ` David Brown
2021-04-10 18:57                               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-12  4:17                               ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-08 17:22                   ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-08 18:26                     ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-08 20:26                     ` David Brown
2021-04-11 13:39                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-11 14:03                     ` David Brown
2021-04-11 14:42                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-11 14:21                     ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-08 19:48               ` Mark Wielaard
2021-04-08 20:33                 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09  6:27                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-09 13:08                   ` Paul Koning
2021-04-09 14:08                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 13:42                 ` Richard Sandiford
2021-04-11 15:06                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 15:56                     ` David Brown
2021-04-11 16:45                       ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-12  9:32                         ` Richard Biener
2021-04-12 10:27                           ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-12 21:24                           ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-13  6:01                             ` Richard Biener
2021-04-13 14:40                               ` Jeff Law
2021-04-13 16:52                                 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-13 17:19                                   ` Jeff Law
2021-04-13 17:32                                     ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-13 23:41                                       ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14  6:44                                         ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-14  7:57                                           ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-14 10:03                                             ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-14 10:19                                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-14 12:08                                                 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-14 16:18                                                   ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 16:35                                                     ` Toon Moene
2021-04-14 16:55                                                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 17:42                                                         ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 18:07                                                           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 17:53                                                     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 16:02                                                   ` Jason Merrill
2021-04-15 16:24                                                     ` Richard Biener
2021-04-15 17:42                                                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-07 14:51             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-07 15:15               ` David Malcolm
2021-04-07 16:24                 ` John Darrington
2021-04-07 17:14                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-07 22:34                   ` David Malcolm
2021-04-08  6:45                     ` John Darrington
2021-04-08 11:56                       ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-08 12:08                         ` John Darrington
2021-04-08 14:54                       ` David Malcolm
2021-04-08 18:21                         ` John Darrington
2021-04-08 18:58                           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09  1:35                           ` David Malcolm
2021-04-09  6:37                             ` John Darrington
2021-04-09 10:37                               ` David Brown
2021-04-09 14:40                                 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 17:01                                   ` David Brown
2021-04-09 18:02                                     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 19:37                                       ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-09 21:02                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 21:17                                           ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-09 21:34                                             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10  2:53                                       ` Liu Hao
2021-04-10  3:15                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 12:50                                           ` Bronek Kozicki
2021-04-10 14:10                                             ` John Darrington
2021-04-10 15:33                                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 19:47                                             ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-10 21:45                                               ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 23:06                                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-10 12:27                                       ` David Brown
2021-04-10 13:04                                         ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 14:49                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 15:17                                           ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 15:54                                             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 16:14                                               ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 16:49                                                 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 15:59                                             ` David Malcolm
2021-04-10 16:09                                               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 20:10                                             ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-10 22:06                                               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-11 13:11                                                 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 14:04                                                   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 22:30                                               ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-11 12:05                                                 ` John Darrington
2021-04-11 13:00                                                   ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-11 13:24                                                   ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 13:43                                                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 13:12                                                 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 13:23                                                 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 13:26                                                   ` Frosku
2021-04-11 13:32                                                     ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 13:30                                                   ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 14:25                                                     ` John Darrington
2021-04-11 14:37                                                       ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 15:04                                                         ` David Brown
2021-04-12  0:08                                                           ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-11 14:17                                                   ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 18:28                                                     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 20:04                                                       ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 20:45                                                         ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 22:30                                                           ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-11 23:06                                                             ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 23:33                                                               ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-12  1:43                                                                 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-12  2:15                                                                   ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-04-12  3:13                                                                   ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-12 17:52                                                                     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-12 18:18                                                                       ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-12  7:25                                                             ` John Darrington
2021-04-12  9:00                                                               ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-04-11 23:13                                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 18:26                                     ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 18:36                                     ` John Darrington
2021-04-09 20:04                                       ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-09 21:40                                         ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-09 22:12                                           ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-09 22:39                                             ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 11:36                                               ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-10 12:35                                                 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 15:04                                                   ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 16:01                                                     ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-10 16:12                                                       ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 19:52                                                       ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 21:29                                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 20:13                                                       ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-10 22:50                                                       ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-11 23:56                                                 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-12  1:03                                                   ` David Edelsohn
2021-04-12  1:34                                                     ` Chris Punches
2021-04-12 10:24                                                       ` Bronek Kozicki
2021-04-12 11:57                                                         ` Bronek Kozicki
2021-04-12 15:25                                                       ` Kalamatee
2021-04-12 21:22                                                       ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-12 23:09                                                         ` Chris Punches
2021-04-13  0:29                                                           ` Daniel (Robin) Smith
2021-04-09 22:58                                             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 23:12                                             ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-10 22:33                                         ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-10 12:37                                       ` David Brown
2021-04-10 15:28                                         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 13:00                               ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-07 18:00                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-31 13:28         ` Remove RMS from the GCC Steering Committee Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-31 13:49           ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-31 14:47           ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-31 14:18         ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-31 14:22           ` Paul Koning
2021-03-31 14:43             ` Joel Sherrill
2021-03-31 15:49               ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-31 18:27                 ` David Edelsohn
2021-04-01 17:07                   ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-01 19:19                     ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-01 20:33                       ` Joseph Myers
2021-04-01 21:03                         ` Christian Groessler
2021-04-01 21:53                         ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-01 22:00                           ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-05 15:32                       ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-06 10:27                       ` Richard Biener
2021-04-06 11:18                         ` Matthias Klose
2021-04-06 14:14                         ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-04-06 17:17                         ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-31 14:56           ` David Malcolm
2021-03-31 15:43             ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-31  1:57     ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-31  2:51       ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-31  3:51         ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-31  7:14     ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-31  8:15       ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-30 15:24 ` Maksim Fomin
2021-03-30 16:20   ` Richard Kenner
2021-03-31 11:08   ` Franz Fehringer
2021-03-30  7:46 mfriley
2021-03-30  8:14 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 23:33 Ville Voutilainen

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