* egcs and g77 @ 1998-07-03 14:48 Juan Casero 1998-07-04 2:00 ` Toon Moene 1998-07-05 15:40 ` Martin von Loewis 0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Juan Casero @ 1998-07-03 14:48 UTC (permalink / raw) To: egcs Greetings everyone - I have been using egcs for some time now on my RedHat 5.0 Linux box with no problems. The compiler seems to generate very efficient and stable code. I do not wish to start a debate about the merits of g77 or f2c but my past experience with g77 has been that it often either fails to compile standard fortran 77 code or it generates the wrong code when compiled with optimizations turned on. I plan to write some Fortran 77 code and I expect I will need to debug it with DDD. Therefore I need to use g77 to compile my code but I hesitate to use it because of my previous experience with the front end. Has g77 received the same attention and improvements as gcc in the egcs development project? Can I trust g77 to reliably generate the proper code with optimizations turned on? As I said I really don't want to start a debate so please a simple yae or nae ( feel free to elaborate as long as it doesn't become argumentative) will suffice. Thank You. -- Juan Casero email: casero@beowulf.cox.miami.edu __ _ / / (_)__ __ ____ __ / /__/ / _ \/ // /\ \/ / . . . t h e c h o i c e o f a /____/_/_//_/\_,_/ /_/\_\ G N U g e n e r a t i o n . . . ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-03 14:48 egcs and g77 Juan Casero @ 1998-07-04 2:00 ` Toon Moene 1998-07-05 11:00 ` Dave Love 1998-07-05 15:40 ` Martin von Loewis 1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread From: Toon Moene @ 1998-07-04 2:00 UTC (permalink / raw) To: casero; +Cc: egcs > I do not wish to start a debate about the merits of g77 > or f2c but my past experience with g77 has been that it > often either fails to compile standard fortran 77 code > or it generates the wrong code when compiled with > optimizations turned on. Unfortunately, you never sent fortran@gnu.org any examples of such failures, so it is hard to say whether they've been solved in the mean time (if they were the compiler's fault). > Can I trust g77 to reliably generate the proper code with > optimizations turned on? As I said I really don't want > to start a debate so please a simple yae or nae ... will > suffice. We cannot answer such a broad question with a simple yes or no. Of course we try to get the compiler bug-free, but in such a large project, there will always be corners containing bugs. My experience is that for our code (a 1300-routine numerical weather forecasting system) egcs is without failure, but you should note that we don't do any complex arithmetic, and I only tested it on my m68k-next-nextstep3 system. Perhaps you can send us some of the failures you get ? Please send them to fortran@gnu.org - if they are of general interest to the egcs crowd, we will forward them here. Thanks, -- Toon Moene ( mailto:toon@moene.indiv.nluug.nl ) Saturnushof 14, 3738 XG Maartensdijk, The Netherlands Phone: +31 346 214290; Fax: +31 346 214286 g77 Support: mailto:fortran@gnu.org ; NWP: http://www.knmi.nl/hirlam ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-04 2:00 ` Toon Moene @ 1998-07-05 11:00 ` Dave Love 1998-07-05 11:55 ` Juan Casero 1998-07-06 4:08 ` Dave Love 0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Dave Love @ 1998-07-05 11:00 UTC (permalink / raw) To: casero; +Cc: egcs >>>>> "Toon" == Toon Moene <toon@moene.indiv.nluug.nl> writes: [the right stuff] Toon> Perhaps you can send us some of the failures you get ? ... but certainly not before at least reading the `Working Programs' node of the g77 manual! If claiming g77 fails to compile standard-conforming code, you probably need to reference the relevant clauses of the Fortran77 and/or Fortran9[05] standard. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-05 11:00 ` Dave Love @ 1998-07-05 11:55 ` Juan Casero 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Toon Moene 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Craig Burley 1998-07-06 4:08 ` Dave Love 1 sibling, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Juan Casero @ 1998-07-05 11:55 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Dave Love, egcs Are you suggesting that g77 can compile Fortran 90 and/or Fortran 95 code? Where is the g77 manual? I was not even aware there was such a thing. As they say ignorance is not an excuse so I offer none. Cheers.... On 05-Jul-98 Dave Love wrote: >>>>>> "Toon" == Toon Moene <toon@moene.indiv.nluug.nl> writes: > > [the right stuff] > > Toon> Perhaps you can send us some of the failures you get ? > > ... but certainly not before at least reading the `Working Programs' > node of the g77 manual! If claiming g77 fails to compile > standard-conforming code, you probably need to reference the relevant > clauses of the Fortran77 and/or Fortran9[05] standard. Juan Casero email: casero@beowulf.cox.miami.edu __ _ / / (_)__ __ ____ __ / /__/ / _ \/ // /\ \/ / . . . t h e c h o i c e o f a /____/_/_//_/\_,_/ /_/\_\ G N U g e n e r a t i o n . . . ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-05 11:55 ` Juan Casero @ 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Toon Moene 1998-07-06 22:11 ` Should web host docs? Was: " Robert Lipe 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Craig Burley 1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread From: Toon Moene @ 1998-07-06 14:48 UTC (permalink / raw) To: casero; +Cc: egcs [ To Juan's defense, he explained to me that software licences might prohibit him from sending the code g77 can't compile - he will e-mail me the error message(s), and - who knows - after some waving of dead chickens, I might have a bright moment and spot the error ] > Where is the g77 manual? I was not even aware there was > such a thing. As they say ignorance is not an excuse so > I offer none. [ Sorry, can't resist: ] Wow, I've been used to people writing fortran@gnu.org who couldn't find the answer to their question in the g77 manual in spite of the fact that it was there, properly indexed, but you win hands down on this front: The g77 manual is the g77.texi file in the .../egcs/gcc/f directory. The "info" files that are made from this file by makeinfo can be viewed with the `info' program or `emacs'. An alternative route is to convert them to HTML using `texi2html', or to Postscript via `tex' and `dvips' (if you have a DVI viewer on your system the last step might not even be necessary, unless you want to actually print the manual; however, do realise that this material is in a kind of flux). Hope This Helps, Toon. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Should web host docs? Was: egcs and g77 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Toon Moene @ 1998-07-06 22:11 ` Robert Lipe 1998-07-07 12:51 ` Dave Love 0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread From: Robert Lipe @ 1998-07-06 22:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: egcs Some dude wrote: > > Where is the g77 manual? I was not even aware there was such a > > thing. As they say ignorance is not an excuse so Toon Moene wrote: [ a perfectly reasonable answer ] > directory. The "info" files that are made from this file by makeinfo > can be viewed with the `info' program or `emacs'. An alternative In the days when every GNU software user had built (or written) the software themselves, I think we could more reasonably expect users to know (or be able to intuit) answers of this form. > route is to convert them to HTML using `texi2html', or to Postscript > via `tex' and `dvips' (if you have a DVI viewer on your system the Would it be worthwhile - at least for releases - to spin these files and include links in the doc or on the egcs web pages? If it's decided worthwhile, I suppose I can add the Makefile targets to populate wwwdocs or whatever. RJL ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Should web host docs? Was: egcs and g77 1998-07-06 22:11 ` Should web host docs? Was: " Robert Lipe @ 1998-07-07 12:51 ` Dave Love 1998-07-08 7:59 ` Craig Burley 0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread From: Dave Love @ 1998-07-07 12:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: egcs >>>>> "RL" == Robert Lipe <robertl@dgii.com> writes: RL> In the days when every GNU software user had built (or written) RL> the software themselves, I think we could more reasonably expect RL> users to know (or be able to intuit) answers of this form. Is egcs-g77 different to any other official RedHat package, though? It does install the info dir entry. RL> If it's decided worthwhile, I suppose I can add the Makefile RL> targets to populate wwwdocs or whatever. If you do, use the current texi2html from ftp.cs.umb.edu/pub/tex. It was hacked to cope with recent Texinfo features used by the g77 manual. Personally, I'd prefer somehow to get people reading what they have locally (even though the Network was the Computer long before it was a trademark). BTW, I think the g77 doc needs a going over before egcs 1.1 to fix stuff pertaining to the g77+gcc-2.8 incarnation. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: Should web host docs? Was: egcs and g77 1998-07-07 12:51 ` Dave Love @ 1998-07-08 7:59 ` Craig Burley 0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Craig Burley @ 1998-07-08 7:59 UTC (permalink / raw) To: d.love; +Cc: egcs >BTW, I think the g77 doc needs a going over before egcs 1.1 to fix >stuff pertaining to the g77+gcc-2.8 incarnation. Absolutely. I've got this on my (virtual) list of things to take care of. tq vm, (burley) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-05 11:55 ` Juan Casero 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Toon Moene @ 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Craig Burley 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Craig Burley @ 1998-07-06 14:48 UTC (permalink / raw) To: casero; +Cc: d.love, egcs >On 05-Jul-98 Dave Love wrote: >> ... but certainly not before at least reading the `Working Programs' >> node of the g77 manual! If claiming g77 fails to compile >> standard-conforming code, you probably need to reference the relevant >> clauses of the Fortran77 and/or Fortran9[05] standard. >Are you suggesting that g77 can compile Fortran 90 and/or Fortran 95 code? >Where is the g77 manual? I was not even aware there was such a thing. As they >say ignorance is not an excuse so I offer none. Yet, it does seem like many more of the questions re g77 that suggest the docs have not been read come via the egcs route. egcs might have become very popular, moreso than the gcc/g77 combination, especially among new g77 users, which could explain the difference. But it might also be that the "pretty wrapping" packaging aspects of egcs, vis-a-vis its supported languages, need ironing out. And it might well be that they already are in egcs 1.1-in-development; we've made some fixes to how the g77 docs are installed, FWIW. `info g77' should work, for example, after a normal installation of egcs 1.1. Also, it seems more likely people will think to look for and find the g77 docs when they've had to take the extra step to obtain g77 instead of just getting it for "free" with most any egcs distribution. Re F90/F95 -- g77 does support a few of the "easier" features of F90, and soon maybe F95 (probably an intrinsic or two), which is why we're interested in bugs g77 has regarding those features, and of course we can't insist people tell us how those bugs indicate violations of the F77 standard. :) But, generally, no, g77 can't yet compile F90 code. We figure a g90 project will be nedeed to ever make that happen, though maybe g77 will "extend" itself to support many examples of F90 code down the road. tq vm, (burley) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-05 11:00 ` Dave Love 1998-07-05 11:55 ` Juan Casero @ 1998-07-06 4:08 ` Dave Love 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Dave Love @ 1998-07-06 4:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: egcs I wrote my comment about standards carelessly. The f90/5 standards are only relevant for post-f77 features or interpretations which g77 claims to support, since it's basically an f77 compiler. An example is some `f90' intrinsics; I've just been referring to the current standard for these. Some of the f90 features which are present may be supported incompletely (e.g. SELECT CASE, IIRC). ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: egcs and g77 1998-07-03 14:48 egcs and g77 Juan Casero 1998-07-04 2:00 ` Toon Moene @ 1998-07-05 15:40 ` Martin von Loewis 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Martin von Loewis @ 1998-07-05 15:40 UTC (permalink / raw) To: casero; +Cc: egcs > As I said I really don't want to start a debate so please a simple > yae or nae. I can offer a clear 'dunno'. AFAIK, integration of the g77 front-end with the backend was given quite some attention in egcs; and optimization bugs would usually count as a back-end problem. OTOH, the gcc and g++ front-end are certainly used by more users than the objc and g77 front-ends. The reason I respond at all is simple: If you don't report the bugs, they won't get fixed. So I'd suggest that you try the compiler and see how it works out. If you think you find a bug, report it. Include every information you can, even source code, if possible. Regards, Martin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~1998-07-08 7:59 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 11+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 1998-07-03 14:48 egcs and g77 Juan Casero 1998-07-04 2:00 ` Toon Moene 1998-07-05 11:00 ` Dave Love 1998-07-05 11:55 ` Juan Casero 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Toon Moene 1998-07-06 22:11 ` Should web host docs? Was: " Robert Lipe 1998-07-07 12:51 ` Dave Love 1998-07-08 7:59 ` Craig Burley 1998-07-06 14:48 ` Craig Burley 1998-07-06 4:08 ` Dave Love 1998-07-05 15:40 ` Martin von Loewis
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