From: Christopher Dimech <dimech@gmx.com>
To: Giacomo Tesio <giacomo@tesio.it>
Cc: Mark Wielaard <mark@klomp.org>, GCC Development <gcc@gcc.gnu.org>,
Nathan Sidwell <nathan@acm.org>
Subject: Re: Remove RMS from the GCC Steering Committee
Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 16:47:08 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <trinity-817b9cc2-7353-4dc8-932b-0e511bc8fa69-1617202028032@3c-app-mailcom-bs16> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20210331152810.00006825@tesio.it>
> Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 at 1:28 AM
> From: "Giacomo Tesio" <giacomo@tesio.it>
> To: "Mark Wielaard" <mark@klomp.org>
> Cc: "GCC Development" <gcc@gcc.gnu.org>, "Nathan Sidwell" <nathan@acm.org>
> Subject: Re: Remove RMS from the GCC Steering Committee
>
> Hi Mark,
>
> I'm a bit in a hurry and do not really want to focus on what happened
> in Harvey: to my eyes that story just show you cannot trust people just
> because they are nice and well known "open source" contributors, or
> because they work for big multinational that "do no evil" or even
> join the Good Guys (TM) of Software Freedom Conservancy.
>
> But let me clarify
>
> On Wed, 31 Mar 2021 13:34:17 +0200 Mark Wielaard wrote:
>
> > I looked a bit at that issue you filed and how they handled your
> > request to remove your code from the project. And I must say I don't
> > really understand what you believe they did wrong, they seemed to have
> > acknowledged and corrected their mistake and then removed all the code
> > you wanted to have removed.
>
> I asked them to `git revert` my changes referencing the issue, so that
> the code I reused in my own fork of Plan 9 was safe that nobody could
> claim copyright of my work after, say, a change in the version control
> system adopted by the project.
>
> Instead they did a `git rebase` over which, I was pretty surprised
> actually, they "accidentaly" squashed some of my own commits verbatim
> (but without my name) in incredibly large commits.
> And you know, they had to git push -f such rebase, breaking all the
> existing github forks (while the `git revert` approach would not have
> caused any issue to anybody)
>
> > There is some disagreement over whether a
> > mass change of function declarations is copyrightable or not.
>
> And implementations. And kernel changes that took a couple of days to
> get right (Harvey kernel was pretty unstable back then). And more I did
> not remember but I noticed back then:
>
>
> > But I happen to agree with them that if there is only one way to do
> > it, then having someone else do the same transformation is a correct
> > way to resolve this.
>
> Sure!
>
> But first, there were several different ways to do that (several
> equivalent typedefs were already in place in u.h, without even
> mentioning macros and so on), and more importantly if you actually
> redo the same work in the same way because there is a single way
> to do that, you do in a dedicated commit with an author that takes
> the clear responsibility for change.
>
> Instead my work (or a totally, byte-for-byte equivalent, one) got
> squashed into gigantic commits that include several very large commits
> of several authors (all mentioned in the commit message... but me).
>
>
> > To make this copyright issue somewhat relevant to GCC. GCC doesn't
> > currently contain individual copyright statements and most of the code
> > is currently assigned to the FSF. So the above mistake won't happen
> > when contributing to GCC, but mostly because of the technicality that
> > you sign away your copyright up front.
>
> Oh sorry, I wasn't clear enough about this.
>
> I'm SURE that this specific issue would not happen on GCC.
> Nor on Linux. Nor in several other Free Software and Open Source
> communities.
>
> But I think you are missing the valuable lesson that the Harvey team
> (some of which actually signed the rms-open-letter) tauht me: I didn't
> expected ANYTHING like this to happen. And I didn't expect SFC to not
> expell a project doing something like this.
>
> I trusted them both. All of them.
>
>
> So ultimately I do not expect this specific issue to occur in a
> hypothetical GCC lead by a Stallman-less Steering Comittee.
>
> But I DO expect that, in the long run, a Stallman-less Steering
> Comittee might do something not aligned with the long-term
> interests of Free Software, abusing my trust again.
>
> Maybe not you. Maybe not the CURRENT Steering Committee.
>
> But people, groups and incentives changes.
> Stallman does not.
It is likely that anothep person or group will evolve, which
although not Stallman-Like, work within the free software idea.
After Newton, there were other illustrious people. Does not mean
everything stops forever after the demise of Richard.
> Giacomo
>
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-03-31 14:47 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 282+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2021-03-26 20:02 Nathan Sidwell
2021-03-26 20:20 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-26 20:51 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-26 21:18 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-26 21:34 ` David Malcolm
2021-03-26 21:09 ` Marek Polacek
2021-03-26 22:53 ` Hi-Angel
2021-03-26 23:50 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-03-27 7:08 ` Didier Kryn
2021-03-27 21:44 ` Andrea Corallo
2021-03-29 17:28 ` Christophe de Dinechin
2021-03-27 13:38 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-27 14:10 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-27 15:45 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-27 17:12 ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-03-27 17:33 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 14:50 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-28 17:25 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-28 19:01 ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-03-28 2:16 ` Óscar Fuentes
2021-03-28 2:27 ` Óscar Fuentes
2021-03-28 4:08 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 12:47 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-28 13:19 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-28 14:33 ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-28 18:13 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-28 18:42 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 19:15 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 0:20 ` Joseph Myers
2021-03-30 1:32 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 8:20 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 2:08 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-30 10:03 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-28 17:58 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 18:24 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-28 23:21 ` Soul Studios
2021-03-29 0:20 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-29 12:18 ` Richard Kenner
2021-03-29 21:41 ` Soul Studios
2021-03-29 23:32 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 0:09 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-30 0:39 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 1:30 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-03-30 1:56 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 9:14 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-30 11:56 ` Richard Kenner
[not found] ` <20210330115515.E8A2033CB0@vlsi1.gnat.com>
2021-03-30 12:33 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 9:28 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-30 12:37 ` Richard Kenner
2021-03-27 20:49 ` Martin Liška
2021-03-27 22:10 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-28 17:48 ` Jeff Law
2021-03-27 22:07 ` Martin Jambor
2021-03-28 15:26 ` Jeff Law
2021-03-29 10:11 ` Richard Biener
2021-03-30 8:25 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 9:47 ` Didier Kryn
2021-03-30 9:52 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 9:52 ` Didier Kryn
2021-03-30 10:12 ` Andrew Haley
2021-03-30 10:34 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 11:12 ` Andrew Haley
2021-03-30 11:32 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 10:50 ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-03-30 13:16 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-30 13:30 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 16:50 ` Martin Jambor
2021-03-30 17:10 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-30 18:30 ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-03-30 18:52 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-30 16:56 ` Markus Böck
2021-03-30 17:07 ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-30 17:45 ` Joseph Myers
2021-03-30 18:13 ` Christopher Dimech
[not found] ` <CAFVAEf2CP87uEuca677MQt4hriQWk5Rn4s9AaQ0yGPUpAeXWpg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <trinity-9f325315-c1b2-4fb5-b094-c0fd1534172a-1617140135769@3c-app-mailcom-bs07>
[not found] ` <CAFVAEf2QDDXMwAu1vtLpf-Gvqz6i19Jmph3dao9V6iWyysudMg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <trinity-b0f59ed8-7545-49d0-979a-b6a5323107e5-1617146046177@3c-app-mailcom-bs07>
2021-03-30 23:56 ` Andrew Sutton
2021-03-30 18:09 ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-30 21:28 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-30 22:18 ` Joseph Myers
2021-03-31 8:53 ` Martin Jambor
2021-03-31 13:26 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-31 11:34 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-31 12:28 ` Richard Biener
2021-03-31 12:55 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-31 12:59 ` David Edelsohn
2021-03-31 13:21 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-06 10:34 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-03-31 13:46 ` Florian Weimer
2021-03-31 15:23 ` David Edelsohn
2021-03-31 15:43 ` Richard Biener
2021-03-31 15:43 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-31 12:46 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-06 22:22 ` GCC association with the FSF Mark Wielaard
2021-04-06 22:28 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-07 14:04 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-07 17:17 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-07 17:21 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-08 15:00 ` David Brown
2021-04-08 16:43 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-08 18:40 ` David Brown
2021-04-11 21:23 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 22:41 ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-08 19:30 ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-04-09 11:48 ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-09 14:47 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 16:30 ` Gabriel Ravier
2021-04-10 12:58 ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-10 16:34 ` David Brown
2021-04-10 18:57 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-12 4:17 ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-08 17:22 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-08 18:26 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-08 20:26 ` David Brown
2021-04-11 13:39 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-11 14:03 ` David Brown
2021-04-11 14:42 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-11 14:21 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-08 19:48 ` Mark Wielaard
2021-04-08 20:33 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 6:27 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-09 13:08 ` Paul Koning
2021-04-09 14:08 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 13:42 ` Richard Sandiford
2021-04-11 15:06 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 15:56 ` David Brown
2021-04-11 16:45 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-12 9:32 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-12 10:27 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-12 21:24 ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-13 6:01 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-13 14:40 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-13 16:52 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-13 17:19 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-13 17:32 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-13 23:41 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 6:44 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-14 7:57 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-14 10:03 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-14 10:19 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-14 12:08 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-14 16:18 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 16:35 ` Toon Moene
2021-04-14 16:55 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 17:42 ` Jeff Law
2021-04-14 18:07 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-14 17:53 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-15 16:02 ` Jason Merrill
2021-04-15 16:24 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-15 17:42 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-07 14:51 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-07 15:15 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-07 16:24 ` John Darrington
2021-04-07 17:14 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-07 22:34 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-08 6:45 ` John Darrington
2021-04-08 11:56 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-08 12:08 ` John Darrington
2021-04-08 14:54 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-08 18:21 ` John Darrington
2021-04-08 18:58 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 1:35 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-09 6:37 ` John Darrington
2021-04-09 10:37 ` David Brown
2021-04-09 14:40 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 17:01 ` David Brown
2021-04-09 18:02 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 19:37 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-09 21:02 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 21:17 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-09 21:34 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 2:53 ` Liu Hao
2021-04-10 3:15 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 12:50 ` Bronek Kozicki
2021-04-10 14:10 ` John Darrington
2021-04-10 15:33 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 19:47 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-10 21:45 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 23:06 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-04-10 12:27 ` David Brown
2021-04-10 13:04 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 14:49 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 15:17 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 15:54 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 16:14 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 16:49 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 15:59 ` David Malcolm
2021-04-10 16:09 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 20:10 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-10 22:06 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-11 13:11 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 14:04 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 22:30 ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-11 12:05 ` John Darrington
2021-04-11 13:00 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-11 13:24 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 13:43 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 13:12 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 13:23 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 13:26 ` Frosku
2021-04-11 13:32 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 13:30 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 14:25 ` John Darrington
2021-04-11 14:37 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-11 15:04 ` David Brown
2021-04-12 0:08 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-11 14:17 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 18:28 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 20:04 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-11 20:45 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 22:30 ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-11 23:06 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-11 23:33 ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-12 1:43 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-12 2:15 ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-04-12 3:13 ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-12 17:52 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-04-12 18:18 ` Adhemerval Zanella
2021-04-12 7:25 ` John Darrington
2021-04-12 9:00 ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-04-11 23:13 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 18:26 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 18:36 ` John Darrington
2021-04-09 20:04 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-09 21:40 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-09 22:12 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-09 22:39 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 11:36 ` Pankaj Jangid
2021-04-10 12:35 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-04-10 15:04 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 16:01 ` Giacomo Tesio
2021-04-10 16:12 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 19:52 ` Thomas Rodgers
2021-04-10 21:29 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-10 20:13 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-10 22:50 ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-11 23:56 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-12 1:03 ` David Edelsohn
2021-04-12 1:34 ` Chris Punches
2021-04-12 10:24 ` Bronek Kozicki
2021-04-12 11:57 ` Bronek Kozicki
2021-04-12 15:25 ` Kalamatee
2021-04-12 21:22 ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-12 23:09 ` Chris Punches
2021-04-13 0:29 ` Daniel (Robin) Smith
2021-04-09 22:58 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 23:12 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-10 22:33 ` Gerald Pfeifer
2021-04-10 12:37 ` David Brown
2021-04-10 15:28 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-09 13:00 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-04-07 18:00 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-31 13:28 ` Remove RMS from the GCC Steering Committee Giacomo Tesio
2021-03-31 13:49 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-31 14:47 ` Christopher Dimech [this message]
2021-03-31 14:18 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-31 14:22 ` Paul Koning
2021-03-31 14:43 ` Joel Sherrill
2021-03-31 15:49 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-31 18:27 ` David Edelsohn
2021-04-01 17:07 ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-01 19:19 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-04-01 20:33 ` Joseph Myers
2021-04-01 21:03 ` Christian Groessler
2021-04-01 21:53 ` Thomas Koenig
2021-04-01 22:00 ` Richard Kenner
2021-04-05 15:32 ` Nathan Sidwell
2021-04-06 10:27 ` Richard Biener
2021-04-06 11:18 ` Matthias Klose
2021-04-06 14:14 ` Siddhesh Poyarekar
2021-04-06 17:17 ` Ian Lance Taylor
2021-03-31 14:56 ` David Malcolm
2021-03-31 15:43 ` Christopher Dimech
2021-03-31 1:57 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-31 2:51 ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-31 3:51 ` Alexandre Oliva
2021-03-31 7:14 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-03-31 8:15 ` JeanHeyd Meneide
2021-03-30 15:24 ` Maksim Fomin
2021-03-30 16:20 ` Richard Kenner
2021-03-31 11:08 ` Franz Fehringer
2021-03-30 7:46 mfriley
2021-03-30 8:14 ` Jonathan Wakely
2021-03-30 23:33 Ville Voutilainen
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