From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 84767 invoked by alias); 27 Nov 2017 17:28:16 -0000 Mailing-List: contact libc-alpha-help@sourceware.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: , Sender: libc-alpha-owner@sourceware.org Received: (qmail 84758 invoked by uid 89); 27 Nov 2017 17:28:16 -0000 Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; auth=none X-Virus-Found: No X-Spam-SWARE-Status: No, score=-1.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,KB_WAM_FROM_NAME_SINGLEWORD,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=no version=3.3.2 spammy=pickup, advisory, upgrades X-HELO: mail-qk0-f193.google.com X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:organization :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=N80Aq+8CayxCReuyatkj7q1ppCm3XmvXxn8XoSAZZwI=; b=gxurf9DzqchyAlalhs/9Jg3AAM7XM/mI5xNiFBpVie6zX+Z1T1zI1g3EQf/T8FXghh tvbBDF32P3U/3MIIxaqIkPRW2wLz9ndjx97TCwgMXie8v8Iyd2o1XWJv8nkm0KGkdjHG dGukkU/vO2hzpyBbdWC4rcCcUvtnS3I1ksUQpvWtjzfAhmKPYIA0YiOVEfdRaREkApzQ W5ynF2W8VBzwJ3moW2l9Z+C7PPbivIEhh/WWDwS7ucwC/UUtJmyfUAQpgc86dBrFm1Iq 6RhO6Ap+4ioWZAfSvFv6nqT71lhHJMOii0xZySqIDdrnainVO3tNK+T6yJtKRhI25lL+ 2fHw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX6gkTH0wNgtWDG3xK4FBmiZVBHNz1To9jO2kQ0aBA60oB7nUCdT 0F4n2WNvMcsy13dOXPN9LKtA4mrNCYU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMbDILxIvoGo50ZnXw3+FusdJCSEVtKq0B9AwAGhWP86R7EKMaXlj92dJbQI630UbexKetzuNw== X-Received: by 10.55.176.66 with SMTP id z63mr42915473qke.149.1511803693054; Mon, 27 Nov 2017 09:28:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [PATCH] ldconfig: set LC_COLLATE to C To: Florian Weimer , Aurelien Jarno , libc-alpha@sourceware.org References: <20171126113204.21318-1-aurelien@aurel32.net> <765daa9b-bddc-48e7-5839-468f6fe75ffd@redhat.com> <983c218a-20c1-d2de-619a-f41623adde1a@redhat.com> From: Carlos O'Donell Message-ID: <33f01ae8-9a7e-8658-5606-5669642d310d@redhat.com> Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2017 17:28:00 -0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <983c218a-20c1-d2de-619a-f41623adde1a@redhat.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-SW-Source: 2017-11/txt/msg00940.txt.bz2 On 11/27/2017 09:16 AM, Florian Weimer wrote: > On 11/27/2017 06:15 PM, Carlos O'Donell wrote: >> On 11/27/2017 09:02 AM, Florian Weimer wrote: >>> On 11/27/2017 05:36 PM, Carlos O'Donell wrote: >>>> A quick brainstorm: >>>> >>>> * Do nothing. A minimal number of users have broken systems because of collation >>>>     in their locale breaks certain packages adding known to sort incorrectly entries >>>>     from their distribution for ld.so.conf.d/. >>>> >>>> * Switch to C collation and have an unknown number of users with broken systems >>>>     because they used locale specific sorting for files they added to the >>>>     ld.so.conf.d/ directory to configure their systems. >>> >>> We can also enumerate twice and warn if there are any differences. >> >> Are you suggesting a 2 release staged change? >> >> * First release compare both collations, warn on differences. >> >> * Change the release default, and stop warning. >> >> It would not make sense to keep warning after the change. > > Why do you say that? > > System administrators might see the warning and realize immediately that this is an important change. Once the change is made to use C/POSIX locale for collation, the warning becomes a false positive. Why issue a warning at that point? No change is required by the system administrator. The warning is important leading up to the change to notify the system administrator that the system behaviour is about to change in the future (particularly if they are on a 2.27-based release and will pickup this change soon e.g. Fedora Rawhide). >>> Or provide a tool like (glibc-system-check?) which reports this and >>> could be extended over time to also check for use of deprecated >>> features/APIs and so on. >> >> Would we use the tool to block upgrades? >> >> Detect /etc/ld.so.conf.d/* file names that would sort differently >> given the current locale and C locale, and return non-zero with >> a warning? > > No, I think it would have to be purely advisory. OK. Given my comments above, do you recommend a 2 release change process? * Deprecate with warnings. * Change default, and remove warning. -- Cheers, Carlos.