From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wr1-x442.google.com (mail-wr1-x442.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::442]) by sourceware.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1AACA385E83A for ; Tue, 28 Jul 2020 19:16:40 +0000 (GMT) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 sourceware.org 1AACA385E83A Received: by mail-wr1-x442.google.com with SMTP id a15so19337575wrh.10 for ; Tue, 28 Jul 2020 12:16:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:cc:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=T1Hc/R39+bN9uPcdD6T2r/67jj3nTnAHif5B1ay8pHI=; b=Hm6yiAHiAlhHold/7x5INmW9jbxJEqS6gD5Ug07qWqCv31SoyR0N7bEirZalPGkNAd K+Wm1lNodkSCJHN3ZlwYfj0rOGFe1b4Wt+dXtVrvMkIm2IhywWXlQV6z/T59euQi4RPx Q0669tnrcjO4KmCVDj/PCgiAhOpQrkn08VK9DY8qPsbO7ibfUiie7wP9U3XKIpP15a5/ Bd5+wtRKRyJGlSGIL0hDPvz/j5NzbMzkdSN5KDBlPj7bOWjfU+OM/yjn82zM40B2w4dT Guyw3w+37sDQL5OiPKydLWBtZrAstiiyKNj/NVBbPYZPmP27Y8YQBSPr1AGH1aUZ+vI3 4r5w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532HK8dNBWv5Ap6vSIPrz8ir8IHl16FoWKPm3Mz41J9BMIUItOpT P0JJ+b+EjHNsxWsNUVScFeQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwx9ZJd2cMFgv3IfPQJ1r1VYVXySp1Hn2ur2CFCcbN43CNVlK0qSqLUkpAzWP97ldJeNp9/Qg== X-Received: by 2002:adf:e94a:: with SMTP id m10mr14401295wrn.249.1595963799226; Tue, 28 Jul 2020 12:16:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2001:a61:3adb:8201:9649:88f:51f8:6a21? ([2001:a61:3adb:8201:9649:88f:51f8:6a21]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 130sm6752622wme.26.2020.07.28.12.16.37 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 28 Jul 2020 12:16:38 -0700 (PDT) Cc: mtk.manpages@gmail.com, enh , Zack Weinberg , Carlos O'Donell , libc-alpha , "Joseph S. Myers" , Paul Eggert Subject: Re: Pseudoterminal terminology (was Re: Rename "master" branch to "main"?) To: Florian Weimer References: <423fbe8b-6b41-d9e8-c4a2-5865d8eeec4b@gmail.com> <990ea0cb-1997-9ad4-e0ea-f5ba54e22066@gmail.com> <875za7u02g.fsf@oldenburg2.str.redhat.com> From: "Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)" Message-ID: <4bc2f508-3a2e-c27e-ddcc-c21cdf604b67@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2020 21:16:35 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <875za7u02g.fsf@oldenburg2.str.redhat.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU, DKIM_VALID_EF, FREEMAIL_FROM, KAM_SHORT, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, SPF_HELO_NONE, SPF_PASS, TXREP autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on server2.sourceware.org X-BeenThere: libc-alpha@sourceware.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Libc-alpha mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2020 19:16:41 -0000 On 7/28/20 5:32 PM, Florian Weimer wrote: > * Michael Kerrisk: > >> Those names (parent, child) do seem strange to me. With process >> creation, those terms make a kind of sense. > > Not really: it's rare that a subprocess does not exit before the process > that launched it. > >> The simplicity of it is appealing. But, how does this read in >> prose documentation. Do we replace actual English words with >> abbreviations ("pty", "tty")? That looks a little weird in writing, >> and seems weirder when spoken aloud. And then: "the pseudoterminal >> pty device" seems a little bit like something I might find in >> "The Department of Redundancy Dept"... > > Maybe we can use “pseudoterminal device” and “terminal device”? So, the proposed terminology would be: * pseudoterminal device pair * pseudoterminal device (formerly: master) * terminal device (formerly: slave) ? It's an interesting idea. I like the concept, but I'd want to see how it looks in rewritten manual pages. I'll take a look. Thanks, MIchael -- Michael Kerrisk Linux man-pages maintainer; http://www.kernel.org/doc/man-pages/ Linux/UNIX System Programming Training: http://man7.org/training/