From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com (us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com [170.10.129.124]) by sourceware.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0B39385840C for ; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 17:36:50 +0000 (GMT) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.4.1 sourceware.org C0B39385840C Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=redhat.com Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=redhat.com DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=redhat.com; s=mimecast20190719; t=1666633010; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=/ULbVpmjuNBXfzqv8LHFXAo9y16XR28bZZkhMcAJ0T0=; b=IrO189HDOmlgnla2w/gb6E1UwbJBYvhWWOZiOO+BxtBGffFvgD2mXg+MKTq3N+r+jGzsyL 5GlesD+MWgsvppzdzHVeV5UqTrmVk+E4LcMyEJeYEn1kUaHPoaTsasgo4akT/Tfr0iuwQm qiLPXhWiKWFnDMiKuVepDb1jD+QtzIk= Received: from mimecast-mx02.redhat.com (mx3-rdu2.redhat.com [66.187.233.73]) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP with STARTTLS (version=TLSv1.2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id us-mta-55-NnrZzEUCNs69IzFiYu34qg-1; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 13:36:48 -0400 X-MC-Unique: NnrZzEUCNs69IzFiYu34qg-1 Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx04.intmail.prod.int.rdu2.redhat.com [10.11.54.4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mimecast-mx02.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B02EF380673C; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 17:36:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from oldenburg.str.redhat.com (unknown [10.2.16.74]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F02632028E94; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 17:36:46 +0000 (UTC) From: Florian Weimer To: Samuel Thibault Cc: libc-alpha@sourceware.org, glibc@packages.debian.org Subject: Re: static pie: confusion between _DYNAMIC, crt1.o, Scrt1.o References: <20221022140614.rnfd4d4nefjmizzi@begin> <6ba3b8ba096fadec66822e2e1f712777b524f66c.camel@xry111.site> <20221022144548.u5rq3ffgietk4zft@begin> <87fsfd5y6g.fsf@oldenburg.str.redhat.com> <20221024103320.6agvlhszkhhnykip@begin> <877d0p5vbz.fsf@oldenburg.str.redhat.com> Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2022 19:36:38 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Mike Frysinger via Libc-alpha's message of "Mon, 24 Oct 2022 21:41:51 +0545") Message-ID: <878rl52kex.fsf@oldenburg.str.redhat.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 3.1 on 10.11.54.4 X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0 X-Mimecast-Originator: redhat.com Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIMWL_WL_HIGH,DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_NONE,TXREP autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.6 (2021-04-09) on server2.sourceware.org List-Id: * Mike Frysinger via Libc-alpha: > On 24 Oct 2022 13:12, Florian Weimer via Libc-alpha wrote: >> * Samuel Thibault: >> > Florian Weimer, le lun. 24 oct. 2022 12:11:03 +0200, a ecrit: >> >> * Samuel Thibault: >> >> >> >> > Is it not possible to make -static -pie get the same behavior? That'd be >> >> > way more orthogonal for people to understand. >> >> >> >> I think you want -static to mean -static-pie if GCC defaults to PIE, >> >> right? >> > >> > That would actually provide the pie benefit automatically for all >> > static executable, yes. Otherwise static pie will be a nice thing, but >> > not actually largely used in practice. And most people won't actually >> > realize it. >> >> That's true. >> >> Fedora uses a specs file fragment that turns -static into -static-pie >> under certain conditions. >> >> >> That will break a few things that use gcc -static to build binaries for >> >> quasi-bare-metal targets using the GNU ELF toolchain (where glibc's >> >> startup code is not use). >> > >> > But then the piece which is saying that glibc's startup code is not in >> > use can be fixed into not using static-pie, can't it? >> >> In theory, yes. How hard it will be depends on the specs file change >> for --enable-default-pie. > > i don't see a problem with -static DTRT. people abusing a compiler for a > target it wasn't designed for means they get the pieces. it's not like > they're using -static in the first place to pull in the C library & gcc > internal libs (which also depend/assume the corresponding OS & C lib). > > plus, -static -no-pie would get you back to a non-PIE static binary. The last part depends on the specs file, it has to be put there explicitly I think. And perhaps -Wl,-no-pie as well? Maybe also do -no-pie implicitly with -static -nostartfiles? Thanks, Florian