On 07 Dec 2021 11:10, C Howland wrote:
>      Should this really be made the new default?

yes

>  I personally don't want it as a default because I want to see
> command line arguments.  Easy for me to get different, but only knowing
> how.  That leads to the next question.

then use the standard `make V=1` or `./configure --disable-silent-rules`

>      Given that silent were made default, it is a big change in terms of
> what people see.  How would you know to change it?  (New feature, most
> people are far from experts in automake.)  Therefore, the directions most
> definitely would need something added that explains it.  (Without knowing
> about it, I can see it taking someone a long time to chase down why they
> suddenly lost the make output.)  Something along the lines of Jon's
> explanation in the patch email needs to end up in README and probably also
> printed by a configure help.

you can make this argument about any change.  we shouldn't be paralyzed by
historical behavior and never make progress.  the automake manual provides
background info about why chatty make is not a good thing.
https://www.gnu.org/software/automake/manual/automake.html#Silencing-Make

the option is standard in the GNU ecosystem and adoption rate is only going
up.  it's already in the --help of configure.  no one has to know or be an
expert in automake to find it.

adding the option to the newlib/README sounds reasonable since it already
has a bunch of these.  want to send a patch ?
-mike