From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from EUR02-DB5-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-db5eur02on2069.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.249.69]) by sourceware.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BCC573858D1E for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:20 +0000 (GMT) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.4.2 sourceware.org BCC573858D1E Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=arm.com Authentication-Results: sourceware.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=arm.com ARC-Filter: OpenARC Filter v1.0.0 sourceware.org BCC573858D1E Authentication-Results: server2.sourceware.org; arc=pass smtp.remote-ip=40.107.249.69 ARC-Seal: i=3; a=rsa-sha256; d=sourceware.org; s=key; t=1712841442; cv=pass; b=XFwMGsEgw8Td9NKvt/G9epCm/cb9tW3uWNM465jXlFYNLCJJ9IsDXpTcLG5e2iJtBhWZUR2MjdO7wD12uL6orTkZ1lu4v3POjQQXEeHtYt8ahyMNSd1+LjBUgzJ5tZqCIeJYJdNBnJQaDXTPC5cl4UDKtgJ8IKiI1HhxeYSZlmk= ARC-Message-Signature: i=3; a=rsa-sha256; d=sourceware.org; s=key; t=1712841442; c=relaxed/simple; bh=m0iBHtT2HcQil3DQSnlzPSq6e6pVc5d87Kerb7bsGP4=; h=DKIM-Signature:DKIM-Signature:Message-ID:Date:Subject:To:From: MIME-Version; b=b4PEnEj+2QJGBe8H+AuwMQmEcnoQvg2eSX1Kdc4bt0n/Qwd7R5/chFmhUqVG+6k2LH4KuKYOwwgGwZqDDMdPcwiN3M01ryB5EzO/bOvBm2/B7T94Srbjyqup3KDcUCigCC3EiUnp0OaxWke8gBydojfDeb71EWX+dqZicQ4sW6k= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=3; server2.sourceware.org ARC-Seal: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=pass; b=HCo+14eyqho0UCdY7I2iTUClIImr+5N81DmcLxEm4CcnuYwdG0ni+T/WZOhbQluDrJDbQzN8D3+o3WnIjxLZOrQ0oFVhVU1nu4D3FNGPEa2pUobHvuMpNq4DVog1ZIBukjS3OFZJj0VY4Ut9pEsNtjTTHWvN+KNywxxWcTFH32E7ZaAGVN284zA9MCjesFGgsHotkz0nCqJFKg9br8LxBfAGa0yIbtZ0nSucR4NmlFz6H0PvWpe5lINRKg/WYN6X3/AwNK2DBRhzeZmDpez2Sr6BPl6UhhMOAI0mjHAH5cwRN02YpZocq3aMH3aE4jAprh+bIIQEvs6R/5HoO00nnQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=IAc6y1OuC+i/Lvyo/ppAsKZwOs85u2hu885IbdNbXPk=; b=d+MEH1kGD6+zMsZ3tcBIF0sd0mhQj8Y0ujVpG4SaihvO95ABhyxUd4Gx8cyWJG52iatc6/H3H2KgeL/IJAVKvyaQOd9FlPC4+4zirso5Pw85p/WnPEjEL++HWKYnimvt4iY68Ih2TDUtL2bF0ZrfJFwnIP9PSO7VPIV44ktAgd+TeWhnyQaRkIXZGEfTWWv8oXdOJ4Tajxuunrn4On5IcSEQkw6ZUtrkCyrEN0NHWqwY6mdfW8sxeyPrKlrp/C6aCy82zReFl386k9O9RvxKWeYEovfkQm9PhTaRFRH6SCwG80kLqJoaOaOBGQglH0AbKKWaQXwvzWDNzFGSThGYlw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass (sender ip is 63.35.35.123) smtp.rcpttodomain=sourceware.org smtp.mailfrom=arm.com; dmarc=pass (p=none sp=none pct=100) action=none header.from=arm.com; dkim=pass (signature was verified) header.d=armh.onmicrosoft.com; arc=pass (0 oda=1 ltdi=1 spf=[1,1,smtp.mailfrom=arm.com] dkim=[1,1,header.d=arm.com] dmarc=[1,1,header.from=arm.com]) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=armh.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-armh-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=IAc6y1OuC+i/Lvyo/ppAsKZwOs85u2hu885IbdNbXPk=; b=f2YPZzjMu3R0bKqiWGSsExZLgHIQeHHBYnAzs/p//1dzViRevchIHpCm8nxbLrkb47ARzOgo1SQiyyyeh6bgP87e7MVbtopvYs1E11mlMuCTQ8a4YrQfucr9yxUAdJUNMPS0U5rXbq1kpJ9yduRRK/HV1Q9hvCnyeKTejMhXvag= Received: from AS9PR05CA0346.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:20b:490::21) by AS8PR08MB10224.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:20b:62b::17) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.7409.55; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:17 +0000 Received: from AM2PEPF0001C70E.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:20b:490:cafe::f7) by AS9PR05CA0346.outlook.office365.com (2603:10a6:20b:490::21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.7472.22 via Frontend Transport; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:17 +0000 X-MS-Exchange-Authentication-Results: spf=pass (sender IP is 63.35.35.123) smtp.mailfrom=arm.com; dkim=pass (signature was verified) header.d=armh.onmicrosoft.com;dmarc=pass action=none header.from=arm.com; Received-SPF: Pass (protection.outlook.com: domain of arm.com designates 63.35.35.123 as permitted sender) receiver=protection.outlook.com; client-ip=63.35.35.123; helo=64aa7808-outbound-1.mta.getcheckrecipient.com; pr=C Received: from 64aa7808-outbound-1.mta.getcheckrecipient.com (63.35.35.123) by AM2PEPF0001C70E.mail.protection.outlook.com (10.167.16.202) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_3, cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.7452.22 via Frontend Transport; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:16 +0000 Received: ("Tessian outbound 9d16f63426bd:v300"); Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:15 +0000 X-CheckRecipientChecked: true X-CR-MTA-CID: 3d847a7c06ec46a4 X-CR-MTA-TID: 64aa7808 Received: from f4d88f8b2a6a.1 by 64aa7808-outbound-1.mta.getcheckrecipient.com id B824C915-FC44-46E2-BCF8-03C9A86D283A.1; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:08 +0000 Received: from EUR05-DB8-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com by 64aa7808-outbound-1.mta.getcheckrecipient.com with ESMTPS id f4d88f8b2a6a.1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384); Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:08 +0000 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=RHLYLpyAQGFO+4NkhVHkxG/3Kffg425YICzpEEcRkyGwVwbKxUm3qbfyQC4Rr7B0cbnqRD115PUyxl1srfBLFku2KgvYsXo0p5nvICWoq6LrYX5EY28CqAkOE+BI8V1X0h0MtSwGVLXgt+kghE+K/FWsFkY8ujFpZO4tKjPP19z2nvYGihqRKdJYKTbRD2t7Vd3YKIgOoXUjrs6a9ql6/Zo8Xu0NBN1e2m8x0qQEW/o7PNPGIR0H1hhkkaMG7gGo7Qq+doYnzqClrN2GUABXK1rR6MRdBGsSotUsfbdKvqVHcbeI8fmkd4W9qBJ7lw7Ok/WFekGKU3TYcR0wN23Otw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=IAc6y1OuC+i/Lvyo/ppAsKZwOs85u2hu885IbdNbXPk=; b=ExkGqryN/kjdLNSr6dp7i0e1c172sRgySPJQcZ27uAHFva9uZp0m4HUwX5t4CRlfsLJzubbT6i1SWTdqCtuQqkmygGqP+tqDGnS4xbVJD1nUCzcHy6mdeZ6Opk64C/xTX2yLK6ur1j0dEmdhM4JqmwpPogxBfxHqay7JHXdVI9itWkxVHn2g78jsQCG/qqZn79m0ep6N1ZDBb4YqHmP/6SvuXP7aIVPA/fVKNe+UiWBdbFeRp8utPCntw/RMe1PlW66he2ubZ/BbC4bywpbDQZiDCKM7lR+Ftx5ROh5/oSdAvqoFQR4JKnjKBW75TKoBeqo1eFql3iJe4qcE9rT8MA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=arm.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=arm.com; dkim=pass header.d=arm.com; arc=none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=armh.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-armh-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=IAc6y1OuC+i/Lvyo/ppAsKZwOs85u2hu885IbdNbXPk=; b=f2YPZzjMu3R0bKqiWGSsExZLgHIQeHHBYnAzs/p//1dzViRevchIHpCm8nxbLrkb47ARzOgo1SQiyyyeh6bgP87e7MVbtopvYs1E11mlMuCTQ8a4YrQfucr9yxUAdJUNMPS0U5rXbq1kpJ9yduRRK/HV1Q9hvCnyeKTejMhXvag= Authentication-Results-Original: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=arm.com; Received: from DU0PR08MB9250.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:10:419::17) by AM7PR08MB5318.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:20b:104::13) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.7409.55; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:07 +0000 Received: from DU0PR08MB9250.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::8d27:4d82:3f55:30]) by DU0PR08MB9250.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::8d27:4d82:3f55:30%7]) with mapi id 15.20.7409.042; Thu, 11 Apr 2024 13:17:07 +0000 Message-ID: <7e164cb4-6385-4c2a-b916-3d9631844d87@arm.com> Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2024 14:17:05 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: Considerations on a gitlab-style forge To: Mark Wielaard , Claudio Bantaloukas via Overseers References: <2668eef94323fc75e43632b2ead4fa5249eaea67.camel@klomp.org> Content-Language: en-CA From: Claudio Bantaloukas In-Reply-To: <2668eef94323fc75e43632b2ead4fa5249eaea67.camel@klomp.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-ClientProxiedBy: LO6P123CA0046.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10a6:600:310::8) To DU0PR08MB9250.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:10:419::17) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: DU0PR08MB9250:EE_|AM7PR08MB5318:EE_|AM2PEPF0001C70E:EE_|AS8PR08MB10224:EE_ X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: f0403064-6bb4-471b-c0c3-08dc5a29b544 x-checkrecipientrouted: true NoDisclaimer: true X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-Relay: 0 X-Microsoft-Antispam-Untrusted: BCL:0; X-Microsoft-Antispam-Message-Info-Original: PHJnwBcldyhGR6eQgebOsdkDnxePcuoefXFUEZ0tjiYWrhciYbh2y1+7o3ohRiTJYXw7Eo6r0MYOS2WXa5BJkQiyULTynYDq8+vm3Hc9PsNf7ip9cZxwIWZI+QcqmayFEMQnScoNsO8TnrlRZutPCcRry9u3Ba0/KUvt0+Q5H9LSPsUTTr4mgW+E+d8QcaC52a0hITfGzuOBLmdn1d4lHv89uKHLeUmsJIUGMf68iZhb7DnRh+wGipEA19o7yzkZdrZPL+JXjvaRH0mBqanYftRHchuSIeZIiVviA9Hg08idfkOAAXqupJFEIUtJthxKuvz32kB3zfBrEck+uhLsiua0+qyK15wh2J++R8JsQOfrieKnUOuisxBP7J41f2uSiW07+nsdoICMHyQd08abxp9EbogJdgLfmNIOdmfp9oRQc1ujt4vvhqtPM02VnRbuEPzkP8QzSg3fhrMps+5oZJmgzZpEcQCVErebVDm6x1YC561xPbn/V4FUgxPzuHAOxxlVBGrLWiTWTA26G+CBq2Os51Kh2KYaYs7exmLdgKcKFd2rQTpLM59C/D5LOHFNoym9d9maHgK1UsTWuJitSuoMPNwb3l28xCJHmAz7K0k= X-Forefront-Antispam-Report-Untrusted: CIP:255.255.255.255;CTRY:;LANG:en;SCL:1;SRV:;IPV:NLI;SFV:NSPM;H:DU0PR08MB9250.eurprd08.prod.outlook.com;PTR:;CAT:NONE;SFS:(13230031)(366007)(376005)(1800799015);DIR:OUT;SFP:1101; X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: AM7PR08MB5318 Original-Authentication-Results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=arm.com; X-EOPAttributedMessage: 0 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStripped: AM2PEPF0001C70E.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id-Prvs: 68508b22-fbd5-4f04-7b25-08dc5a29afe9 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0; X-Microsoft-Antispam-Message-Info: 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 X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:63.35.35.123;CTRY:IE;LANG:en;SCL:1;SRV:;IPV:CAL;SFV:NSPM;H:64aa7808-outbound-1.mta.getcheckrecipient.com;PTR:ec2-63-35-35-123.eu-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com;CAT:NONE;SFS:(13230031)(376005)(1800799015)(36860700004)(82310400014);DIR:OUT;SFP:1101; X-OriginatorOrg: arm.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Apr 2024 13:17:16.0639 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: f0403064-6bb4-471b-c0c3-08dc5a29b544 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: f34e5979-57d9-4aaa-ad4d-b122a662184d X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalAttributedTenantConnectingIp: TenantId=f34e5979-57d9-4aaa-ad4d-b122a662184d;Ip=[63.35.35.123];Helo=[64aa7808-outbound-1.mta.getcheckrecipient.com] X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: AM2PEPF0001C70E.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Anonymous X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: AS8PR08MB10224 X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.4 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,FORGED_SPF_HELO,KAM_DMARC_NONE,KAM_SHORT,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_NONE,TXREP,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.6 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.6 (2021-04-09) on server2.sourceware.org List-Id: On 4/10/2024 2:57 PM, Mark Wielaard wrote: > Hi Claudio, > > On Tue, 2024-04-09 at 09:35 +0000, Claudio Bantaloukas via Overseers > wrote: >> I recently read your emails in the binutils mailing list and, since feed= back was requested, here's some. >> I miss the high level feature caleld pull requests in github and merge r= equests in gitlab. For licensing reasons these two projects are not ok. >> I just saw https://sfconservancy.org/GiveUpGitHub/ >> Have the overseers considered adding https://github.com/go-gitea/gitea o= r its fork https://forgejo.org/ ? > > Sort answer, no. But that doesn't mean it cannot happen. > Longer answer is that different people have different ideas about what > a "pull-request model" precisely is. In general since most core > toolchain and developer tool projects on Sourceware are highly invested > in an email workflow we have been working on services that work best > with that. See for example the Sourceware roadmap from a couple of > years back that explains the why behind the current services: > https://gnu.wildebeest.org/blog/mjw/2022/06/22/sourceware-gnu-toolchain-i= nfrastructure-roadmap/ > > Recently Tom and Jeff expressed interest in a "pull-request model" > https://inbox.sourceware.org/libc-alpha/9124eadc81726959bb775e913ce6e6aaa= 5e51e45.camel@klomp.org/ > > Maybe they can help guide us towards that model and the necessary > services to implement it. We could for example resurrect the gerrit > setup (assuming that is how people envision the "pull-request model" to > work). Or we could indeed look into other services like gitea, forgejo, > pagure or sourcehut. > > Note that there is a mirror on sr.ht already that you could play with > https://sr.ht/~sourceware/binutils-gdb/ Thank you for answering, I've been trying to come up with a high level reason why something about those forges is desirable to people like me and the best I could come up with is this. Having a single place where a developer can see: - the change they are working on in the context of the wider project - any code review comments their fellow developers may have - whether these changes are likely to break things for others - what others are working on - that doesn't feel like Donald Norman's proverbial teapot! Would this make sense to others? > > Cheers, > > Mark -- Claudio Bantaloukas IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confid= ential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, p= lease notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any= other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in = any medium. Thank you.