* archive format change @ 2000-12-30 6:08 Tom Tromey 2000-04-03 12:09 ` Tom Tromey ` (3 more replies) 0 siblings, 4 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Tom Tromey @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Overseers List When did the mailing list archive format change? And why? If you look at the April and the Jan-March pages for java-discuss you'll notice that April uses a different format. I've gotten complaints about the change. Tom ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 archive format change Tom Tromey @ 2000-04-03 12:09 ` Tom Tromey 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jeffrey A Law ` (2 subsequent siblings) 3 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Tom Tromey @ 2000-04-03 12:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Overseers List When did the mailing list archive format change? And why? If you look at the April and the Jan-March pages for java-discuss you'll notice that April uses a different format. I've gotten complaints about the change. Tom ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 archive format change Tom Tromey 2000-04-03 12:09 ` Tom Tromey @ 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jeffrey A Law 2000-04-03 12:24 ` Jeffrey A Law 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Benjamin Kosnik 3 siblings, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread From: Jeffrey A Law @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: tromey; +Cc: Overseers List In message < 87em8nm21y.fsf@cygnus.com >you write: > When did the mailing list archive format change? > And why? > > If you look at the April and the Jan-March pages for java-discuss > you'll notice that April uses a different format. I've gotten > complaints about the change. Twasn't me. jeff ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jeffrey A Law @ 2000-04-03 12:24 ` Jeffrey A Law 0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jeffrey A Law @ 2000-04-03 12:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: tromey; +Cc: Overseers List In message < 87em8nm21y.fsf@cygnus.com >you write: > When did the mailing list archive format change? > And why? > > If you look at the April and the Jan-March pages for java-discuss > you'll notice that April uses a different format. I've gotten > complaints about the change. Twasn't me. jeff ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 archive format change Tom Tromey 2000-04-03 12:09 ` Tom Tromey 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jeffrey A Law @ 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:09 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Benjamin Kosnik 3 siblings, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Tom Tromey; +Cc: Overseers List On Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 01:12:25PM -0600, Tom Tromey wrote: > When did the mailing list archive format change? > And why? I changed gdb, gdb-cvs, gdb-patches, java-discuss and one or two other lists from the medium/low volume format date index to the high volume format index this weekend. I've been generating both styles of index for most of March, but when the quarter ended I had the formats automatically roll over. Old format: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/java-discuss/2000-q1/ New format: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/java-discuss/2000-03/ I've often changed the style of mailing list archive from low-volume to medium-volume to high-volume as the traffic on lists increase. When I do this, I generate both formats for a small overlap period, and change the top-level list index.html so that at the next date increment, the new style is pointed to. Then I stop generating the old format archive. The high volume format is suitable for lists with five messages a day or more. For fewer messages then that, the high volume index is not an efficient use of screen space. The low-volume index (which is what java-discuss was using) is not an efficient display (IMHO) for a higher volume list. Furthermore, when a mailing list has large volume and you're using a low-volume (one-archive-per-year) or medium-volume (one-archive-per-quarter) display, the mailing list indexes become really large (== slow to download) towards the end of the time period. Java-discuss should have monthly mailing list archives given its current volume. Whether it has the high-volume index format or not is a separate matter -- if you're unhappy with the high-volume format, I can have a low-volume index used for java-discuss. (it's just another command line option to www-archives.sh). This is the first time I've heard of anyone unhappy with the change in archive formatting, I've never bothered to tell anyone what I was doing behind the scenes because no one seemed to care one way or the other. I can change things back as you prefer. Jason PS- In case anyone is curious, I'm doing all of this by editing the files /qmail/listarch/.qmail-LISTNAME and changing the timeperiod marker in /www/sourceware/ml/LISTNAME/index.html e.g. from "<!--newquartersgohere-->" to "<!--newmonthsgohere-->" ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 13:09 ` Jason Molenda 0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 13:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Tom Tromey; +Cc: Overseers List On Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 01:12:25PM -0600, Tom Tromey wrote: > When did the mailing list archive format change? > And why? I changed gdb, gdb-cvs, gdb-patches, java-discuss and one or two other lists from the medium/low volume format date index to the high volume format index this weekend. I've been generating both styles of index for most of March, but when the quarter ended I had the formats automatically roll over. Old format: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/java-discuss/2000-q1/ New format: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/java-discuss/2000-03/ I've often changed the style of mailing list archive from low-volume to medium-volume to high-volume as the traffic on lists increase. When I do this, I generate both formats for a small overlap period, and change the top-level list index.html so that at the next date increment, the new style is pointed to. Then I stop generating the old format archive. The high volume format is suitable for lists with five messages a day or more. For fewer messages then that, the high volume index is not an efficient use of screen space. The low-volume index (which is what java-discuss was using) is not an efficient display (IMHO) for a higher volume list. Furthermore, when a mailing list has large volume and you're using a low-volume (one-archive-per-year) or medium-volume (one-archive-per-quarter) display, the mailing list indexes become really large (== slow to download) towards the end of the time period. Java-discuss should have monthly mailing list archives given its current volume. Whether it has the high-volume index format or not is a separate matter -- if you're unhappy with the high-volume format, I can have a low-volume index used for java-discuss. (it's just another command line option to www-archives.sh). This is the first time I've heard of anyone unhappy with the change in archive formatting, I've never bothered to tell anyone what I was doing behind the scenes because no one seemed to care one way or the other. I can change things back as you prefer. Jason PS- In case anyone is curious, I'm doing all of this by editing the files /qmail/listarch/.qmail-LISTNAME and changing the timeperiod marker in /www/sourceware/ml/LISTNAME/index.html e.g. from "<!--newquartersgohere-->" to "<!--newmonthsgohere-->" ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 archive format change Tom Tromey ` (2 preceding siblings ...) 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Benjamin Kosnik 2000-04-03 12:39 ` Benjamin Kosnik 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 3 siblings, 2 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Benjamin Kosnik @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Tom Tromey; +Cc: Overseers List yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ I'm just using the thread index right now because the date index is messed up. What's the deal? This "Mail converted by MHonArc 2.4.5" stuff appears to be new. -benjamin On 3 Apr 2000, Tom Tromey wrote: > When did the mailing list archive format change? > And why? > > If you look at the April and the Jan-March pages for java-discuss > you'll notice that April uses a different format. I've gotten > complaints about the change. > > Tom > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Benjamin Kosnik @ 2000-04-03 12:39 ` Benjamin Kosnik 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 1 sibling, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Benjamin Kosnik @ 2000-04-03 12:39 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Tom Tromey; +Cc: Overseers List yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ I'm just using the thread index right now because the date index is messed up. What's the deal? This "Mail converted by MHonArc 2.4.5" stuff appears to be new. -benjamin On 3 Apr 2000, Tom Tromey wrote: > When did the mailing list archive format change? > And why? > > If you look at the April and the Jan-March pages for java-discuss > you'll notice that April uses a different format. I've gotten > complaints about the change. > > Tom > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Benjamin Kosnik 2000-04-03 12:39 ` Benjamin Kosnik @ 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:13 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 1 sibling, 2 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Benjamin Kosnik; +Cc: Tom Tromey, Overseers List On Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 12:39:50PM -0700, Benjamin Kosnik wrote: > > yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: > > http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ Er.. there's only one note in this archive, and it's filed under the correct date. What's the problem? > I'm just using the thread index right now because the date index is > messed up. I've never seen any problem with mhonarc like this. Can you provide a better example? > What's the deal? This "Mail converted by MHonArc 2.4.5" stuff appears to > be new. No, I switched to 2.4.5 a while ago, it's a bug patch release from 2.4.4 which I've been using for quite some time now (and 2.4.4 is a bug patch release for 2.4.3 which I was using for even longer :-) Jason ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 13:13 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 1 sibling, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 13:13 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Benjamin Kosnik; +Cc: Tom Tromey, Overseers List On Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 12:39:50PM -0700, Benjamin Kosnik wrote: > > yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: > > http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ Er.. there's only one note in this archive, and it's filed under the correct date. What's the problem? > I'm just using the thread index right now because the date index is > messed up. I've never seen any problem with mhonarc like this. Can you provide a better example? > What's the deal? This "Mail converted by MHonArc 2.4.5" stuff appears to > be new. No, I switched to 2.4.5 a while ago, it's a bug patch release from 2.4.4 which I've been using for quite some time now (and 2.4.4 is a bug patch release for 2.4.3 which I was using for even longer :-) Jason ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:13 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:17 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 1 sibling, 2 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Benjamin Kosnik; +Cc: Tom Tromey, Overseers List On Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 01:10:52PM -0700, Jason Molenda wrote: > > yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: > > > > http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ > > Er.. there's only one note in this archive, and it's filed under > the correct date. What's the problem? Oh wait, I didn't see that there was crap beyond the first page of text. (the first page looked perfectly normal, it was when I scrolled down that I saw oddness) I'll check it out tonight. J ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 13:17 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 1 sibling, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 13:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Benjamin Kosnik; +Cc: Tom Tromey, Overseers List On Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 01:10:52PM -0700, Jason Molenda wrote: > > yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: > > > > http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ > > Er.. there's only one note in this archive, and it's filed under > the correct date. What's the problem? Oh wait, I didn't see that there was crap beyond the first page of text. (the first page looked perfectly normal, it was when I scrolled down that I saw oddness) I'll check it out tonight. J ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:17 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 14:30 ` Jason Molenda 1 sibling, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-12-30 6:08 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Benjamin Kosnik; +Cc: Tom Tromey, Overseers List > > > yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: > > > > > > http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ I've got it. I changed my monthly-ml-tasks scripts to create a placeholder index.html if a directory had no mail notes archived in it yet. This was to avoid the problem where the /ml/libstdc++/index.html has a "April - June 2000" link, but when the user clicks on it, they get a "Permission denied" or "File not found" error because there is nothing in that directory yet. My script created a little one-paragraph index.html which said "No messages for this time period yet". Much better than an error, which made people think something was wrong with sourceware. It looks like that placeholder index.html has confused mhonarc greatly. It has happened for a few other lists, as well. I'll fix them tonight by hand and see if there is a way I can make my placeholder page w/o confusing mhonarc. Jason ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
* Re: archive format change 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 14:30 ` Jason Molenda 0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread From: Jason Molenda @ 2000-04-03 14:30 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Benjamin Kosnik; +Cc: Tom Tromey, Overseers List > > > yeah. the date sorts in particular are incredibly screwed up: > > > > > > http://sourceware.cygnus.com/ml/libstdc++/2000-q2/ I've got it. I changed my monthly-ml-tasks scripts to create a placeholder index.html if a directory had no mail notes archived in it yet. This was to avoid the problem where the /ml/libstdc++/index.html has a "April - June 2000" link, but when the user clicks on it, they get a "Permission denied" or "File not found" error because there is nothing in that directory yet. My script created a little one-paragraph index.html which said "No messages for this time period yet". Much better than an error, which made people think something was wrong with sourceware. It looks like that placeholder index.html has confused mhonarc greatly. It has happened for a few other lists, as well. I'll fix them tonight by hand and see if there is a way I can make my placeholder page w/o confusing mhonarc. Jason ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2000-12-30 6:08 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 14+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2000-12-30 6:08 archive format change Tom Tromey 2000-04-03 12:09 ` Tom Tromey 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jeffrey A Law 2000-04-03 12:24 ` Jeffrey A Law 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:09 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Benjamin Kosnik 2000-04-03 12:39 ` Benjamin Kosnik 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:13 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 13:17 ` Jason Molenda 2000-12-30 6:08 ` Jason Molenda 2000-04-03 14:30 ` Jason Molenda
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