New Xconq Prerelease

New Xconq Prerelease

[Eric McDonald]

Hello Xconquerors,

A new prerelease of Xconq is available here:
   http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=124062

(Windows installer, source tarball, and RPM packages.)

Enjoy,
   Eric

P.S. If you are looking for a MacOS version, visit the 
'xconq-unsupported' section of the abovementioned Web page.

Re: [Xconq-general] Re: New Xconq Prerelease

[Eric McDonald]

Andreas Bringedal wrote:
> Currently downloading on my 56k modem... 

Ouch. It's only 7.5 MB, though....

>One thing though.  For us computer illiterate people(of which there are
> more of than one might think) it's rather confusing to have a zillion download options.  
> Would it be easily doably to highlight the
> playable download file among all the others uninteresting files(uninteresting for the pure player) in red or green?   

http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=124062&package_id=135573&release_id=285719

Is that better?

BTW, almost everything listed there is "playable". Some of it is 
"playable" on Linux, and some of it must be compiled before it is 
"playable". Windows isn't the only platform in the universe.

>Sure, even I
> managed to find the .exe win 32 bit file 

Yes, I made sure it had "SETUP" in all uppercase letters for the 
computer illiterate and other Windows users. ;-)

FYI, 39 of the 52 downloads in the previous file release were for the 
Windows installer, and it did not have "SETUP" in all uppercase letters, 
and it was not even the first download on the list.

>but I had to search through the rest of the non interesting stuff and it would be rather
> player friendly to have the player executable file highlighted.  I wouldn't be surprised it there are even greater degrees of
> computer illiterate people than me that couldn't be bothered to figure it out.

In the future, I'll just quote the URL for the new file release and not 
for all the other Xconq-related package sections.

> Btw, great work. It's fun to lurk around when so much is happening.

Thanks. It is indeed an exciting time for Xconq development.

Eric

Re: [Xconq-general] Re: New Xconq Prerelease

[Andreas Bringedal]

>>One thing though.  For us computer illiterate people(of which there are
>> more of than one might think) it's rather confusing to have a zillion download options.  
>> Would it be easily doably to highlight the
>> playable download file among all the others uninteresting files(uninteresting for the pure player) in red or green?   
> 
> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=124062&package_id=135573&release_id=285719
> 
> Is that better?

Umm, not really.  Perhaps I should illustrate what I read when I see that page for the first time.   It looks something like this:

Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe



 
> BTW, almost everything listed there is "playable". Some of it is 
> "playable" on Linux, and some of it must be compiled before it is 
> "playable". Windows isn't the only platform in the universe.
> 
>>Sure, even I
>> managed to find the .exe win 32 bit file 
> 
> Yes, I made sure it had "SETUP" in all uppercase letters for the 
> computer illiterate and other Windows users. ;-)
> 
> FYI, 39 of the 52 downloads in the previous file release were for the 
> Windows installer, and it did not have "SETUP" in all uppercase letters, 
> and it was not even the first download on the list.
> 
>>but I had to search through the rest of the non interesting stuff and it would be rather
>> player friendly to have the player executable file highlighted.  I wouldn't be surprised it there are even greater degrees of
>> computer illiterate people than me that couldn't be bothered to figure it out.
> 
> In the future, I'll just quote the URL for the new file release and not 
> for all the other Xconq-related package sections.
> 
>> Btw, great work. It's fun to lurk around when so much is happening.
> 
> Thanks. It is indeed an exciting time for Xconq development.
> 
> Eric
> 
> 
>

Re: [Xconq-general] Re: New Xconq Prerelease

[Andreas Bringedal]

>>>One thing though.  For us computer illiterate people(of which there are
>>> more of than one might think) it's rather confusing to have a zillion download options.  Would it be easily doably to highlight 
>>> the
>>> playable download file among all the others uninteresting files(uninteresting for the pure player) in red or green?
>>
>> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=124062&package_id=135573&release_id=285719
>>
>> Is that better?
>
> Umm, not really.  Perhaps I should illustrate what I read when I see that page for the first time.   It looks something like this:
>
> Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble
> Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe
> Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe
> Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe

Damn, the latest windows update has made my system very unstable.

Anyway, below is what I saw the first time.  I saw 25+ various downloads.  After looking closely I did find the windows version but 
what I was hoping for was was a download page that were very easy to understand.

Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblewinexe
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble

Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble

Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble
Xconq7.5gobblegobblegobble size gobble gobble gobblegobble


If it instead had been like this:
Xconq 7.5  game files
Windows version
Mac version
Xxx version

Xconq 7.5  development files
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble
gobblegobblegobblegobblegobble

Re: [Xconq-general] Re: New Xconq Prerelease

[Eric McDonald]

Andreas Bringedal wrote:

> After looking closely I did find the windows version but 
> what I was hoping for was was a download page that were very easy to 
> understand.

> If it instead had been like this:
> Xconq 7.5  game files
> Windows version
> Mac version
> Xxx version

Well, I could split the 'xconq' package section into new 
'xconq-windows', 'xconq-rpms', and 'xconq-sources' package sections when 
I do another release. This is more work for me, because I would have to 
create 3 file releases instead of just 1. Also, Sourceforge appears to 
sort package sections alphabetically, so your 'xconq-windows' package 
section would not appear until near the end of all the "gobbles". Right 
now, your Windows download appears at the _top_ above all the other 
files; all that a Windows illiterate must do is see the "SETUP.exe". How 
hard is that?

But, I agree that the download screen looks cluttered. Blame 
Sourceforge; don't blame me. Why don't you submit a feature request to 
the Sourceforge people?
   http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=add&group_id=1&atid=350001
Choose "Project: File Release System" from the "Category" menu on that page.

Just tell the Sourceforge people that you would like a big button on the 
File Release System downloads page that says "Simple View". And, if 
someone clicks on the "Simple View" button, it will display something in 
the following format (with lots of white space and bigger letters):

   package-section-name
      file-release-name
   =====================================================================
         file1-name            (Size = 1.6MB)   (32-bit Windows Program)
   ---------------------------------------------------------------------
         file2-name            (Size = 1.6MB)   (Source RPM)
   ---------------------------------------------------------------------
         file3-name            (Size = 1.5MB)   (Gzipped Source)
...



I would suggest that you write "Simplified Downloads View" for the 
"Summary" text field on their feature request page. You can put your 
description (like the one I just gave you) in the "Detailed Description" 
text field. As a technical note, you might also want to tell them that 
you would like your view preference to be stored in a cookie, so that it 
is remembered next time you visit to download a new file. When you are 
finished filling in the "Detailed Description", just click the "SUBMIT" 
button at the bottom of the page.

Eric

Re: [Xconq-general] Re: New Xconq Prerelease

[Andreas Bringedal]

>Right now, your Windows download appears at the _top_ above all the other files; all that a Windows illiterate must do is see the 
>"SETUP.exe". How hard is that?

Not hard but I'm a bit gobble allergic.



> But, I agree that the download screen looks cluttered. Blame Sourceforge; don't blame me. Why don't you submit a feature request 
> to the Sourceforge people?
>   http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=add&group_id=1&atid=350001

Good idea.  I'll look into it.


PS is there any plans for improving the gameplay mechanisms for Xconq?  I have some few problems with it.  The way Civilization 
handles units is imo quite easier.

What if the relatively large window on the right had of the screen(that lists the unit types) were made into a city/transport view 
of occupied units it would make it far easier to play I think.  I don't have a need for that window much and therefore it would be a 
much better use for it the way I play(...).   Maybe when you're not viewing a unit then the current display of produced units could 
be displayed?  Also if you have a special order to fire at a specific unit in a transport/city then it would be easy if the 
transport/city content were displayed in that window and allowed to to click on the units there.  Then the microscopic display on 
the mapboard could be removed which would clean up the map and play enormously. A number in the corner of a city equal to the number 
of units in it would be enough to show the player where his units are, when he can click on the city and get the city overview in 
the sidewindow.

Then there is the map movement.  Maybe I'm not doing it right but when I move the mouse around I get these tiny map moves each time 
the mouse moves across the map border.  Could that be removed and replaced with around 8 arrow buttons(8 directions) which moves the 
map window half a map window length per click?  A ninth centre button could centre on the unit and it could all be keyed to the 
keypad.

It would also be nice to have the two pull down meny that's called 'Play' and 'More' to be called 'Unit Orders' or just 'Orders' 
instead.  It would be far more intuitive. I believe civ 1 was such a huge success because the game was nearly entirely intuitive.

Well, it's easy to ask for features.  It hardly cost me any calories :-)

Cheers,
Andreas

Re: [Xconq-general] Re: New Xconq Prerelease

[Eric McDonald]

Andreas Bringedal wrote:

> PS is there any plans for improving the gameplay mechanisms for Xconq?  

Yes, plenty of plans. And things are being done. See all the previous 
discussion about the SDL interface in the 'xconq7' mailing list 
archives, in the 'xconq.org' forums, etc....

> What if the relatively large window on the right had of the screen(that 
> lists the unit types) were made into a city/transport view of occupied 
> units it would make it far easier to play I think.  I don't have a need 
> for that window much and therefore it would be a much better use for it 
> the way I play(...).   

You are talking about the Tcl/Tk interface here. This does not apply to 
all the Xconq interfaces in general.

I am developing on the SDL interface so that we can phase out the Tcl/Tk 
interface. I agree that the unit types panel on the right hand of the 
Tcl/Tk map window is wasted space. This is one of my quite numerous 
complaints about that interface. This panel is not present in the SDL 
interface. (If you want to see the SDL interface, choose the "Xconq 
(Experimental)" option when you use the Xconq installer program. After 
installation, go to "Start Menu | All Programs | Xconq | Xconq 
(Experimental)". Please remember that the SDL interface is still in 
development. There are not setup screens yet; even saving games does not 
work yet.)

>Maybe when you're not viewing a unit then the 
> current display of produced units could be displayed?  

I am not sure what you mean.

>Also if you have 
> a special order to fire at a specific unit in a transport/city then it 
> would be easy if the transport/city content were displayed in that 
> window and allowed to to click on the units there.  

This feature request has already been entered:
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1069858&group_id=124062&atid=698375

Also, this discussion has occurred on the 'xconq7' mailing list before.
See, for example:
   http://sources.redhat.com/ml/xconq7/2004/msg01126.html

>A number in the corner of a city equal to the 
> number of units in it would be enough to show the player where his units 
> are, when he can click on the city and get the city overview in the 
> sidewindow.

Putting a number in the corner of a transport is something that was done 
in other TBS games such as Empire Master and Strategic Conquest, and it 
was useful. I thought it was superior to Xconq's attempts to display 
scaled-down views of every member of a stack.

Although I did not explicitly mention the number display in my occupant 
view proposal (see above email thread on 'xconq7'), I believe that 
indicating the number of units in a stack would be a good idea.

> Then there is the map movement.  Maybe I'm not doing it right but when I 
> move the mouse around I get these tiny map moves each time the mouse 
> moves across the map border.  Could that be removed and replaced with 
> around 8 arrow buttons(8 directions) which moves the map window half a 
> map window length per click?  A ninth centre button could centre on the 
> unit and it could all be keyed to the keypad.

I agree that the tiny map movements (autoscrolling) is annoying. And so 
do other people. Matthew Skala has proposed getting rid of this before. 
The Tcl/Tk interface already has (disabled) support for scrollbars. 
Since I am not interested in working on the Tcl/Tk interface, I will 
leave that as an exercise for someone else to fix. However, in the SDL 
interface, I plan on implementing map navigation via keyboard, i.e. what 
you are suggesting.

> It would also be nice to have the two pull down meny that's called 
> 'Play' and 'More' to be called 'Unit Orders' or just 'Orders' instead.  
> It would be far more intuitive. I believe civ 1 was such a huge success 
> because the game was nearly entirely intuitive.

That is an idea. And, I think it is a simple enough fix to the Tcl/Tk 
interface, that I might do it, __if you submit a feature request:
   http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=124062&atid=698375
Click on the "Submit New" button near the top of the window, and fill 
out the fields.

Eric