Custom locales seem not to work

Custom locales seem not to work

[Алекса -скрыто-]

I noticed that Cygwin-linked applications fail to use the proper language code from a Windows custom locale, and revert to C instead. Is that a bug?

Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Brian Inglis]

On 2021-06-21 07:23, Алекса -скрыто- via Cygwin wrote:
> I noticed that Cygwin-linked applications fail to use the proper 
> language code from a Windows custom locale, and revert to C instead. 
> Is that a bug?
Cygwin automatically tries to pick your locale using Windows system 
language, country, and regional settings, if you have set them. Many 
Cygwin packages are not localized, do not come with localizations, may 
not support certain locales, or may have incomplete translations. For 
example, on my system, the following are the only Cygwin programs 
installed with Russian localizations (no others are):

$ ls -xw72 /usr/share/locale/ru*/*
/usr/share/locale/ru/LC_MESSAGES:
alacarte.mo                 alternatives.mo
appstream.mo                appstream-glib.mo
aspell.mo                   atk10.mo
at-spi2-core.mo             bash.mo
bfd.mo                      binutils.mo
bison.mo                    bison-runtime.mo
clisp.mo                    clisplow.mo
coreutils.mo                cpio.mo
cpplib.mo                   cygwin32-cpplib.mo
cygwin32-gcc.mo             dialog.mo
diffutils.mo                dos2unix.mo
epiphany.mo                 exif.mo
findutils.mo                flex.mo
gas.mo                      gcal.mo
gcc.mo                      gcr.mo
gdk-pixbuf.mo               gettext-runtime.mo
gettext-tools.mo            git.mo
glib20.mo                   glib-networking.mo
gnome-doc-utils.mo          gnome-keyring.mo
gnome-menus-3.0.mo          gnupg.mo
gnupg2.mo                   gprof.mo
grep.mo                     gsettings-desktop-schemas.mo
gstreamer-1.0.mo            gtk20.mo
gtk20-properties.mo         gtk30.mo
gtk30-properties.mo         gvfs.mo
help2man.mo                 i686-pc-cygwin-bfd.mo
i686-pc-cygwin-binutils.mo  i686-pc-cygwin-gas.mo
i686-pc-cygwin-gprof.mo     i686-pc-cygwin-ld.mo
iso_15924.mo                iso_3166.mo
iso_3166-1.mo               iso_3166-3.mo
iso_4217.mo                 iso_639.mo
iso_639_3.mo                iso_639-2.mo
iso_639-3.mo                isoquery.mo
json-glib-1.0.mo            ld.mo
lftp.mo                     libexif-12.mo
libfm.mo                    libgpg-error.mo
libgsf.mo                   libiconv.mo
libidn2.mo                  libisocodes.mo
libsecret.mo                libsoup.mo
libwnck.mo                  libwnck-3.0.mo
lxappearance.mo             lxappearance-obconf.mo
lxinput.mo                  lxpanel.mo
lxsession.mo                lxtask.mo
lxterminal.mo               lynx.mo
mailutils.mo                make.mo
man-db.mo                   man-db-gnulib.mo
midori.mo                   openbox.mo
osinfo-db-tools.mo          pcmanfm.mo
popt.mo                     psmisc.mo
rpm.mo                      sed.mo
sharutils.mo                tar.mo
tcsh.cat                    texinfo.mo
util-linux.mo               vte-0.0.mo
WebKitGTK-2.0.mo            WebKitGTK-3.0.mo
wget.mo                     wget2.mo
wget-gnulib.mo              whois.mo
xarchiver.mo                xdg-user-dirs.mo
xdg-user-dirs-gtk.mo        xkeyboard-config.mo

/usr/share/locale/ru/LC_TIME:
coreutils.mo

/usr/share/locale/ru_UA/LC_MESSAGES:
tcsh.cat

Which applications do you have problems with, what locale do you wish to 
use, and what are your locale settings; try running the command below 
and post your input and output (don't worry if some of your output is in 
Русский or Кириллица):

	$ for o in -s -u -i -n -f ''; do locale $o; done
	en_US
	en_GB
	en_CA
	en_CA
	en_CA
	LANG=en_CA.UTF-8
	LC_CTYPE="en_CA.UTF-8"
	LC_NUMERIC="en_CA.UTF-8"
	LC_TIME="en_CA.UTF-8"
	LC_COLLATE="en_CA.UTF-8"
	LC_MONETARY="en_CA.UTF-8"
	LC_MESSAGES="en_CA.UTF-8"
	LC_ALL=

so you can see I run Windows system default US English, user default 
GB/UK English, input, non-Unicode, and regional formats Canadian English 
(and customized some of those settings).

-- 
Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis, Calgary, Alberta, Canada

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Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Thomas Wolff]

Am 21.06.2021 um 15:23 schrieb Алекса -скрыто- via Cygwin:
> I noticed that Cygwin-linked applications fail to use the proper language code from a Windows custom locale, and revert to C instead. Is that a bug?
If you define a Windows custom locale, how would you expect it to be 
referred to from cygwin, i.e. which POSIX locale name should be used to 
be mapped to it and how should this mapping be magically deployed into 
cygwin?
I don't think such a mechanism can easily be designed or implemented.
Thomas

Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Brian Inglis]

On 2021-06-21 12:21, Thomas Wolff wrote:
> Am 21.06.2021 um 15:23 schrieb Алекса -скрыто- via Cygwin:
>> I noticed that Cygwin-linked applications fail to use the proper 
>> language code from a Windows custom locale, and revert to C instead. 
>> Is that a bug?

> If you define a Windows custom locale, how would you expect it to be 
> referred to from cygwin, i.e. which POSIX locale name should be used to 
> be mapped to it and how should this mapping be magically deployed into 
> cygwin?
> I don't think such a mechanism can easily be designed or implemented.

If the OP is using a Windows supplemental or replacement locale 
installation, rather than just customizing the locale information, could 
they please export the LDML as UTF8 text and attach it to their post.
If the locale identifiers are sufficiently non-standard, they would 
require a custom mapping in Cygwin.

-- 
Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis, Calgary, Alberta, Canada

This email may be disturbing to some readers as it contains
too much technical detail. Reader discretion is advised.
[Data in binary units and prefixes, physical quantities in SI.]

RE: Custom locales seem not to work

[Алекса -скрыто-]

The locale provides the necessary codes, so I don't see the issue.

​    <special xmlns:msLocale="http://schemas.microsoft.com/globalization/2004/08/carib/ldml">
      <msLocale:cultureInfoVersion type="3.0" />
      <msLocale:cultureAndRegionInfoName type="ie-XX" />
      <msLocale:geoId>223</msLocale:geoId>
      <msLocale:countryCode>41</msLocale:countryCode>
      <msLocale:parentName type="fr-CH" />
      <msLocale:languageNameAbbr type="INE" />
      <msLocale:languageIsoName type="threeLetters">ile</msLocale:languageIsoName>
      <msLocale:languageIsoName type="twoLetters">ie</msLocale:languageIsoName>
      <msLocale:nativeName type="Interlingue" />
      <msLocale:regionEnglishName type="Worldwide" />
      <msLocale:regionNativeName type="Panmundal" />
      <msLocale:regionIsoName type="threeLetters">XXX</msLocale:regionIsoName>
      <msLocale:regionIsoName type="twoLetters">XX</msLocale:regionIsoName>
      <msLocale:regionWindowsName type="threeLetters">XXX</msLocale:regionWindowsName>
      <msLocale:englishName type="Interlingue (Occidental)" />
      <msLocale:sortName type="en-US" />
      <msLocale:sortGuid type="{00000001-57EE-1E5C-00B4-D0000BB1E11E}" />
      <msLocale:codePagesName type="fr-CH" />
      <msLocale:englishLanguage type="Interlingue" />
      <msLocale:nativeLanguage type="Interlingue" />
      <msLocale:keyboardsToInstall type="100c:00020409" />
    </special>
  </identity>

Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Brian Inglis]

On 2021-06-22 02:50, Алекса -скрыто- via Cygwin wrote:
> The locale provides the necessary codes, so I don't see the issue.
> 
> ​    <special xmlns:msLocale="http://schemas.microsoft.com/globalization/2004/08/carib/ldml">
>        <msLocale:cultureInfoVersion type="3.0" />
>        <msLocale:cultureAndRegionInfoName type="ie-XX" />
>        <msLocale:geoId>223</msLocale:geoId>
>        <msLocale:countryCode>41</msLocale:countryCode>
>        <msLocale:parentName type="fr-CH" />
>        <msLocale:languageNameAbbr type="INE" />
>        <msLocale:languageIsoName type="threeLetters">ile</msLocale:languageIsoName>
>        <msLocale:languageIsoName type="twoLetters">ie</msLocale:languageIsoName>
>        <msLocale:nativeName type="Interlingue" />
>        <msLocale:regionEnglishName type="Worldwide" />
>        <msLocale:regionNativeName type="Panmundal" />
>        <msLocale:regionIsoName type="threeLetters">XXX</msLocale:regionIsoName>
>        <msLocale:regionIsoName type="twoLetters">XX</msLocale:regionIsoName>
>        <msLocale:regionWindowsName type="threeLetters">XXX</msLocale:regionWindowsName>
>        <msLocale:englishName type="Interlingue (Occidental)" />
>        <msLocale:sortName type="en-US" />
>        <msLocale:sortGuid type="{00000001-57EE-1E5C-00B4-D0000BB1E11E}" />
>        <msLocale:codePagesName type="fr-CH" />
>        <msLocale:englishLanguage type="Interlingue" />
>        <msLocale:nativeLanguage type="Interlingue" />
>        <msLocale:keyboardsToInstall type="100c:00020409" />
>      </special>
>    </identity>
> 

I have never seen ie used as a language code under Linux systems, and it 
is interlingual, associated with unspecified territory code XX, so you 
would have to set each locale category separately to achieve the desired 
effects: fr_CH or en_US.

What does Cygwin show when you run the locale dump command I posted 
under a shell:

	$ for o in -s -u -i -n -f ''; do locale $o; done

-- 
Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis, Calgary, Alberta, Canada

This email may be disturbing to some readers as it contains
too much technical detail. Reader discretion is advised.
[Data in binary units and prefixes, physical quantities in SI.]

Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Алекса -скрыто-]

> I have never seen ie used as a language code under Linux systems, and it 
> is interlingual, associated with unspecified territory code XX, so you 
> would have to set each locale category separately to achieve the desired 
> effects: fr_CH or en_US.

... the locale should be set to "ie_XX.UTF-8", which the locale data provides, not "C" like Cygwin does now.

Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Brian Inglis]

On 2021-06-26 08:58, Алекса -скрыто- via Cygwin wrote:
>> I have never seen ie used as a language code under Linux systems, and it
>> is interlingual, associated with unspecified territory code XX, so you
>> would have to set each locale category separately to achieve the desired
>> effects: fr_CH or en_US.

> ... the locale should be set to "ie_XX.UTF-8", which the locale data provides, not "C" like Cygwin does now.

Which are non-interoperable Windows-only totally meaningless language 
and territory values to Cygwin startup or any Cygwin, Linux, or Unix 
program based on Unix libraries or code, so everything might map to the 
system default locale at best, or hardwired built-in C/POSIX locale at 
worst.

That custom locale would be better if developed as a fr_CH replacement 
or supplementary Windows locale.

-- 
Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis, Calgary, Alberta, Canada

This email may be disturbing to some readers as it contains
too much technical detail. Reader discretion is advised.
[Data in binary units and prefixes, physical quantities in SI.]

Re: Custom locales seem not to work

[Brian Inglis]

On 2021-06-26 13:29, Brian Inglis wrote:
> On 2021-06-26 08:58, Алекса -скрыто- via Cygwin wrote:
>>> I have never seen ie used as a language code under Linux systems, and it
>>> is interlingual, associated with unspecified territory code XX, so you
>>> would have to set each locale category separately to achieve the desired
>>> effects: fr_CH or en_US.
> 
>> ... the locale should be set to "ie_XX.UTF-8", which the locale data 
>> provides, not "C" like Cygwin does now.

If you setup non-interoperable custom locales, it is likely that Cygwin 
may not be seeing anything it can map, so will default to the hardwired 
built-in C/POSIX locale.

You need to help us diagnose what, if anything, Cygwin may be seeing 
from your custom Windows locale.

What does Cygwin show when you run the locale dump command from a shell:

     $ for o in -s -u -i -n -f ''; do locale $o; done

> Which are non-interoperable Windows-only totally meaningless language 
> and territory values to Cygwin startup or any Cygwin, Linux, or Unix 
> program based on Unix libraries or code, so everything might map to the 
> system default locale at best, or hardwired built-in C/POSIX locale at 
> worst.
> 
> That custom locale would be better if developed as a fr_CH replacement 
> or supplementary Windows locale.

It might also help if you followed the Cygwin problem reporting guidelines:

	https://cygwin.com/problems.html

and attached the required output as plain text to your next response.

-- 
Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis, Calgary, Alberta, Canada

This email may be disturbing to some readers as it contains
too much technical detail. Reader discretion is advised.
[Data in binary units and prefixes, physical quantities in SI.]