how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[OpenMacNews]

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hi all,

i'm building insight v6.4 on OSX 10.4.5.

i've installed TclTk (TclTkAquaBI v8.4.10.0) as frameworks in:

	/Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework
	/Library/Frameworks/Tk.framework

i've found no obvious reference in insight's configure to an EXTERNAL
tcl/tk install ...

what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?

is:

	setenv CPPFLAGS "-I/Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Headers
- -I/Library/Frameworks/Tk.framework/Headers"
	setenv LDFLAGS "-F/Library/Frameworks -framework Tcl -framework Tk"

prior to config/make sufficient?

thx!

richard

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Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Hermann-Simon Lichte]

Hello Richard,

> what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?

On http://sourceware.org/insight/faq.php it says:

Right now, Insight MUST be built using the versions of Tcl, Tk, and  
Itcl that come with the sources. We're working to fix that, but it is  
going to take a lot of time. (Want to help?)

Cheers,
Hermann

Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[OpenMacNews]

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hi hermann,

>> what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?
> 
> On http://sourceware.org/insight/faq.php it says:

argh ... faq'd again! ;-)

> Right now, Insight MUST be built using the versions of Tcl, Tk, and Itcl
> that come with the sources.

ok. since that's true, i'm assuming that UNLESS i build/install insight
into a non-sys path (e.g., /usr/local/insight/) it will OVERWRITE
exsiting tcl/tk "stuff" in /usr &/or /usr/local.  yes?

if true, then if i install into, say, /usr/local/insight/, how do i then
'tell' gdb about it?

(reading the FAQ, just in case ...)

> We're working to fix that, but it is going
> to take a lot of time. (Want to help?)

too much of a newbie to be anything other than a guinea pig ... but can
do that.

cheers,

richard


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Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Hermann-Simon Lichte]

> ok. since that's true, i'm assuming that UNLESS i build/install  
> insight
> into a non-sys path (e.g., /usr/local/insight/) it will OVERWRITE
> exsiting tcl/tk "stuff" in /usr &/or /usr/local.  yes?

Insight will create a lib-directory inside your chosen path that will  
contain the tcl/tk libs, so no need to worry.

> too much of a newbie to be anything other than a guinea pig ... but  
> can
> do that.

I'd still consider myself a newbie as well. Okay, I have used Insight  
for a while now on a Wintel machine, but now I'd like to get the Mac  
OS X port more stable, so I am starting to get my hands on Insight's  
internals. At least you're not alone with your platform :-)

Cheers,
Hermann

RE: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Dave Korn]

On 14 March 2006 08:30, Hermann-Simon Lichte wrote:

> Hello Richard,
> 
>> what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?
> 
> On http://sourceware.org/insight/faq.php it says:
> 
> Right now, Insight MUST be built using the versions of Tcl, Tk, and
> Itcl that come with the sources. We're working to fix that, but it is
> going to take a lot of time. (Want to help?)
> 


  That's a red herring, as far as I'm aware it's very out-of-date info and
8.4.10 should work fine.

  The real question is where Richard has TCL_LIBRARY and TK_LIBRARY pointed
at.  See faq Q2.4.



    cheers,
      DaveK
-- 
Can't think of a witty .sigline today....

Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[OpenMacNews]

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hi dave,

>>> what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?
>> On http://sourceware.org/insight/faq.php it says:
>>
>> Right now, Insight MUST be built using the versions of Tcl, Tk, and
>> Itcl that come with the sources. We're working to fix that, but it is
>> going to take a lot of time. (Want to help?)
>>
>   That's a red herring,

damn subversive fish!  ;-)

> as far as I'm aware it's very out-of-date info and
> 8.4.10 should work fine.
> 
>   The real question is where Richard has TCL_LIBRARY and TK_LIBRARY pointed
> at.  See faq Q2.4.

well, i agree, therein lies the challenge wrt the 'framework' builds on OSX.

currently, i've:

setenv TCL_LIBRARY  "-F/Library/Frameworks -framework Tcl"
setenv TK_LIBRARY   "-F/Library/Frameworks -framework Tk"
setenv TCL_INCLUDES "-I/Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Headers"
setenv TK_INCLUDES  "-I/Library/Frameworks/Tk.framework/Headers"

which have been working for most other situations, but fail --
apparently in insight's case -- to point to the right (i.e., mine)
tclConfig.sh etc etc

i'd, of course, appreciate any education/enlightment!

thx.

richard

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RE: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Dave Korn]

On 14 March 2006 18:26, OpenMacNews wrote:

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> 
> hi dave,
> 
>>>> what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?
>>> On http://sourceware.org/insight/faq.php it says:
>>> 
>>> Right now, Insight MUST be built using the versions of Tcl, Tk, and
>>> Itcl that come with the sources. We're working to fix that, but it is
>>> going to take a lot of time. (Want to help?)
>>> 
>>   That's a red herring,
> 
> damn subversive fish!  ;-)

  If it wasn't for those damn subversive fish we'd all be squashed like
sardines by the powers-that-be!  Little known fact: Guy Fawkes was a fish.[*]
 
>> as far as I'm aware it's very out-of-date info and
>> 8.4.10 should work fine.
>> 
>>   The real question is where Richard has TCL_LIBRARY and TK_LIBRARY pointed
>> at.  See faq Q2.4.
> 
> well, i agree, therein lies the challenge wrt the 'framework' builds on OSX.
> 
> currently, i've:
> 
> setenv TCL_LIBRARY  "-F/Library/Frameworks -framework Tcl"
> setenv TK_LIBRARY   "-F/Library/Frameworks -framework Tk"
> setenv TCL_INCLUDES "-I/Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework/Headers"
> setenv TK_INCLUDES  "-I/Library/Frameworks/Tk.framework/Headers"
> 
> which have been working for most other situations, but fail --
> apparently in insight's case -- to point to the right (i.e., mine)
> tclConfig.sh etc etc

  It seems strange to me to have those flags and options in there, as far as I
know both the T*_LIBRARY defines should be plain unardorned directory paths.
I don't know for sure about the T*_INCLUDES defines.  T*_LIBRARY are the
necessary paths for the tcl/tk interpreters to find their files, and the flags
are almost certainly wrong, but the XXX_INCLUDES defines are just part of
configure trying to find the C header files for compiling code that
interoperates with tcl/tk; in this case, adding some flags might make sense,
much like defining CC='gcc -g -O2' does in other cases.  But I don't know for
sure.

  However before you run too much further down this thread wait for the other
reply I was about to post to the other thread!

    cheers,
      DaveK

[*] - Not true.
-- 
Can't think of a witty .sigline today....

Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Keith Seitz]

Dave Korn wrote:
> On 14 March 2006 08:30, Hermann-Simon Lichte wrote:
>   That's a red herring, as far as I'm aware it's very out-of-date info and
> 8.4.10 should work fine.

Altough I haven't tested it much, Tcl/Tk 8.4.12 appears to work fine. I 
haven't tried 8.5 yet.

Keith

Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Keith Seitz]

Hermann-Simon Lichte wrote:
> Hello Richard,
> 
>> what must i do to ensure insight's use of *my* tcl/tk frameworks?
> 
> On http://sourceware.org/insight/faq.php it says:
> 
> Right now, Insight MUST be built using the versions of Tcl, Tk, and Itcl 
> that come with the sources. We're working to fix that, but it is going 
> to take a lot of time. (Want to help?)

Okay, well that's mostly true. For example, I just replaced the versions 
of tcl and tk that come with Insight with the latest stable release from 
ActiveState. Add the configure.in and Makefile.in from the 
sourceware.org versions, and poof! Insight built with tcl/tk 8.4.12.

Now, as for using an external insight, the FAQ is correct. There is no 
way to do this just yet. It's going to require a bunch of autoconf 
hacking, and it could get tricky, since CVS will *always* have a copy 
Tcl around (for dejagnu).

I just haven't had either the time or the motivation to embark on this. 
I'm just not sure it's worth it: insight is on its last legs, as it were.

Keith

Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[OpenMacNews]

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hi keith,

> insight is on its last legs, as it were.

well THAT certainly caught my attention!

care to clarify for a noob ?  is it being replaced? just dying off?  are
all the developers quitting & opening scuba shops in the Dutch Antilles?

cheers,

richard
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Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[Keith Seitz]

OpenMacNews wrote:
>> insight is on its last legs, as it were.
> 
> well THAT certainly caught my attention!
> 
> care to clarify for a noob ?  is it being replaced? just dying off?  are
> all the developers quitting & opening scuba shops in the Dutch Antilles?

I'm just being blunt. There are no insight developers. I still do some 
things -- mostly bug fixes and snapshots.

The FSF considers Insight *not* to have been donated to them by Cygnus 
Solutions (acquired by Red Hat in 2000). So the copyrights on all the 
insight sources are held by Red Hat, who I cannot convince to spend ten 
minutes signing a letter indicating to the FSF that they consider the 
sources part of gdb (and consequently, "owned" by the FSF).

So whenever I get a non-trivial patch (like the syntax highlighting one 
several months ago), I must have the contributor sign a Red Hat 
assignment (same form that is used by Cygwin). It makes life much more 
challenging.

Nonetheless, I still try to use Insight for my work (when I'm not 
working on eclipse or other pure-java work). Unfortunately, gdb is 
really beginning to cause me problems. I've been unable to use it for 
weeks on libgcj hacking, and I haven't had the time to diagnose the 
(mostly thread-related) problems.

So it's not dead in the literal sense, but it is in a perpetual state of 
maintenance, which (to me) is the same thing.

Keith

Re: how to link insight against 'external' TclTk frameworks on OSX

[OpenMacNews]

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keith,

>> care to clarify for a noob ?  is it being replaced? just dying off?  are
>> all the developers quitting & opening scuba shops in the Dutch Antilles?
>
> I'm just being blunt. There are no insight developers. I still do some
> things -- mostly bug fixes and snapshots.
>
> The FSF considers Insight *not* to have been donated to them by Cygnus
> Solutions (acquired by Red Hat in 2000). So the copyrights on all the
> insight sources are held by Red Hat, who I cannot convince to spend ten
> minutes signing a letter indicating to the FSF that they consider the
> sources part of gdb (and consequently, "owned" by the FSF).
>
> So whenever I get a non-trivial patch (like the syntax highlighting one
> several months ago), I must have the contributor sign a Red Hat
> assignment (same form that is used by Cygwin). It makes life much more
> challenging.
>
> Nonetheless, I still try to use Insight for my work (when I'm not
> working on eclipse or other pure-java work). Unfortunately, gdb is
> really beginning to cause me problems. I've been unable to use it for
> weeks on libgcj hacking, and I haven't had the time to diagnose the
> (mostly thread-related) problems.
>
> So it's not dead in the literal sense, but it is in a perpetual state of
> maintenance, which (to me) is the same thing.

well said.  i *do* appreciate the candor!

and, i agree, given the state of affairs, not a reliable bet ...
especially in a world that is not (gasp!) 100% redhat ;-)

cheers,

richard

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