From: Adhemerval Zanella Netto <adhemerval.zanella@linaro.org>
To: "Jason A. Donenfeld" <Jason@zx2c4.com>,
Florian Weimer <fweimer@redhat.com>
Cc: libc-alpha@sourceware.org,
"Cristian Rodríguez" <crrodriguez@opensuse.org>,
"Paul Eggert" <eggert@cs.ucla.edu>,
linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH v2] arc4random: simplify design for better safety
Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2022 08:35:21 -0300 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <0319b66f-b3b5-3357-1fa9-c9e1d2448427@linaro.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Yt/OAZH0iX/0lj89@zx2c4.com>
On 26/07/22 08:20, Jason A. Donenfeld wrote:
> Hey Florian,
>
> On Tue, Jul 26, 2022 at 01:12:28PM +0200, Florian Weimer wrote:
>>>> What happens if /dev/random is actually /dev/urandom? Will the poll
>>>> call fail?
>>>
>>> Yes. I'm unsure if you're asking this because it'd be a nice
>>> simplification to only have to open one fd, or because you're worried
>>> about confusion. I don't think the confusion problem is one we should
>>> take too seriously, but if you're concerned, we can always fstat and
>>> check the maj/min. Seems a bit much, though.
>>
>> Turning /dev/random into /dev/urandom (e.g. with a symbolic link) used
>> to be the only way to get some applications working because they tried
>> to read from /dev/random at a higher rate than the system was estimating
>> entropy coming in. We may have to do something differently here if the
>> failing poll causes too much breakage.
>
> The "backup plan" would be to sleep-loop-read /proc/sys/kernel/random/entropy_avail
> until it passes a certain threshold one time. This might also work on even older
> kernels than the poll() trick. But that's pretty darn ugly, so it's not
> obvious to me where the cut-off in frustration is, when we throw our
> hands up and decide the ugliness is worth it compared to whatever
> problems we happen to be facing at the time with the poll() technique.
> But at least there is an alternative, should we need it.
I think the poll trick is way better, although I also think it is very Linux
specific. Should we move it to Linux sysdeps?
The /proc/sys/kernel/random/entropy_avail would require to open another file
descriptor, which I think we avoid for arc4random if possible.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2022-07-26 11:35 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 81+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <YtwgTySJyky0OcgG@zx2c4.com>
2022-07-23 16:25 ` arc4random - are you sure we want these? Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-23 17:18 ` Paul Eggert
2022-07-24 23:55 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 20:31 ` Paul Eggert
2022-07-23 17:39 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-23 22:54 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 15:33 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-25 15:59 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-25 17:41 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-25 16:18 ` Sandy Harris
2022-07-25 16:40 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-25 16:49 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-25 16:51 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 17:44 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-25 18:33 ` Cristian Rodríguez
2022-07-25 18:49 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-27 1:54 ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-07-27 2:16 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-27 2:45 ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-07-27 11:34 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-27 12:32 ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-07-27 12:49 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-27 20:15 ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-07-27 21:59 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-28 0:30 ` Theodore Ts'o
2022-07-28 0:39 ` Cristian Rodríguez
2022-07-27 15:39 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-23 19:04 ` Cristian Rodríguez
2022-07-23 22:59 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-24 16:23 ` Cristian Rodríguez
2022-07-24 21:57 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 10:14 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-25 10:11 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-25 11:04 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 12:39 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-25 13:43 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 13:58 ` Cristian Rodríguez
2022-07-25 16:06 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-25 16:43 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-26 14:27 ` Overwrittting AT_RANDOM after use (was Re: arc4random - are you sure we want these?) Yann Droneaud
2022-07-26 14:35 ` arc4random - are you sure we want these? Yann Droneaud
2022-07-25 13:25 ` Jeffrey Walton
2022-07-25 13:48 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 14:56 ` Rich Felker
2022-07-25 22:57 ` [PATCH] arc4random: simplify design for better safety Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 23:11 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 23:28 ` [PATCH v2] " Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-25 23:59 ` Eric Biggers
2022-07-26 10:26 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 1:10 ` Mark Harris
2022-07-26 10:41 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 11:06 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-26 16:51 ` Mark Harris
2022-07-26 18:42 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 19:18 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-26 19:24 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 9:55 ` Florian Weimer
2022-07-26 11:04 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 11:07 ` [PATCH v3] " Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 11:11 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 11:12 ` [PATCH v2] " Florian Weimer
2022-07-26 11:20 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 11:35 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto [this message]
2022-07-26 11:33 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-26 11:54 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 12:08 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 12:20 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 12:34 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-26 12:47 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 13:11 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-26 13:30 ` [PATCH v4] " Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 15:21 ` Yann Droneaud
2022-07-26 16:20 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-26 18:36 ` Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 19:08 ` [PATCH v5] " Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 19:58 ` [PATCH v6] " Jason A. Donenfeld
2022-07-26 20:17 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-26 20:56 ` Adhemerval Zanella Netto
2022-07-28 10:29 ` Szabolcs Nagy
2022-07-28 10:36 ` Szabolcs Nagy
2022-07-28 11:01 ` Adhemerval Zanella
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